Very low dose of propecia EOD + IH Top 3?

[Jimboy]

Hi there guys!

I was on fin for 5 months... I think i have a naturally higher estrogene lvl (I'm 20) and it was WAY TOO HIGH while on fin...

As most of you guys know the DHT is lowered after a single dose for about a week.. even with a low dosage.

So what I'm trying to do is to try a VERY LOW DOSE (0,15 mg) every 2nd day + daily IH's top 3... Maybe I'll add a powerful topical like RU58841 once a day.

Is that a good idea? I really want to reduce the excess estrogene i already have in my body, but I'm also scared that this combo may manipulate my hormonal balance too much.

any thoughts?

[CausticSymmetry]

Jimboy - You might try some DIM (Diindolylmethane) to help metabolize any excess estrogens you have.

[Crusher]

Jimboy,
as long as you have no intolerable sides from fin, go on with it. But don't expect too much from fin.
The dosage shouldn't be higher than 0,15 - 0,25 mg each day (my expierience; I dropped fin because of the
terrible sides). You also have to consider this:
Fin is very oldschooled, it's only working for your vertex-area and not for your front (for most of the fin-user).

To answer your question, from my point of view only fin
may manipulate your hormonal balance too much.

[Jimboy]

The reason for me to quit fin was a enlargement of my left breast after 4 months or so... due to the excess of estrogene, i guess.... here's my bloodwork up to date (I'm getting my newest bloodwork Tomorrow!!)

On fin for 3 months:

- Estradiol: 81,6 pg/ml (Referenzbereich: 11,6-41,2) ****

- Testosteron: 8,01 ng/ml (Referenzbereich: 2,40-8,27)


Bloodwork 3 months after quitting:
- TSH (basal): 4,260 uU/ml (0,270-4,200) ***

- Testosteron: 4,43 ng/ml (2,40-8,27)
- Estradiol: 29,2 pg/ml (11,6-41,2)

- Prolactin: 12,55 ng/ml (2,10-17,70)
- follicle stimulating (?) hormone: 2,1 (1,4-18,1)


Bloodwork ca. 5 months after quitting

- TSH (basal): 2,320 uU/ml (0,270-4,200)
- free T4: 1,61 (0,97-1,80)
- T-3: 130,6 (80,0 - 200,0)
- AK gg. Thyroidea mier. Ag.: 10,3 (0,0 - 34,0)

- Testosteron: 6,91 ng/ml (2,40-8,27)
- Estradiol: 43,1 pg/ml (11,6-41,2) ***

- Prolactin: 14,01 ng/ml (2,10-17,70)
- follicle stimulating (?) hormone: 2,6 (1,4-18,1)

=========================================
Bloodwork NOW (16.02.2009), 13 months after quitting Fin:

- IgE (Proteindiagnostik): 149,70 lU/ml (0,00 - 100,00) ***

- TSH (basal): 5,180 uU/ml (0,270-4,200) ***
- free T4: 1,29 (0,97-1,80)
- T-3: 128,5 (80,0 - 200,0)
- AK gg. Thyroidea mier. Ag.: 12,2 (0,0 - 34,0)

- Testosteron: 6,29 ng/ml (2,40-8,27)
- Estradiol: 54,3 pg/ml (11,6-41,2) ***

- Prolactin: 16,25 ng/ml (2,10-17,70)
- follicle stimulating (?) hormone: 3,0(1,4-18,1

[Jimboy]

right now i'm looking for something to stop my hairloss... I tried a laser helmet but it didn't help. I don't think i can include ALL the pills listed on the immortal hair page... and I don't have the money either..

[CausticSymmetry]

Jimboy - Your prolactin is high and that accounts for Gyno. Elevated prolactin is a huge tendancy to be hypothyroid.

See how a basal temperature test goes (Look up Broda Barnes thyroid test) This can be done a home and if you are out of range, you're probably low thyroid.

Also look into mucuna pruriens. This can lower prolactin somewhat, but if it's thyroid this would be key.

See more info about thyroid here:

http://www.immortalhair.org/physiology.htm

[sublime9]

Jim,

I have suffered no ill affects taking IH's entire regimen and .5mg of propecia. As IH noted DIM is a good addition and one that I take as well along with maca to take care of the estrogen upswing.

[Jimboy]

hey guys, thanks for the replies... i'll get my next bloodwork results tomorrow and I'll post them, so that we have actual values!

[Jimboy]

So guys, my blood work from last week... I was able to get my total Testosterone lvl, but NOT DHT! DAMN! I told him! whatever

Protein diagnosis:
IgE: 132,60 IU/ml (0,00-100,00) ***

Thyroid:
TSH (basal): 3,440 uU/ml (0,270-4,200)
free t4: 1,20 ng/dl (0,97-1,80)
free t3: 149,1 ng/dl (80,0-200,0)

HORMONES:
Follicle stimulating hormone: 5,8 mU/ml (1,4-18,1)
Östradiol (E2): 44,1 pg/ml (11,6-41,2) ***
Prolactin: 18,97 ng/ml (2,10-17,70) ***
Testosterone: 7,16 ng/ml (2,40-8,27)
free Testosterone: 0,150 ng/ml (0,026-0,167)

free testosterone: 2,1% (1,6-3,0) Dunno what this means.

sexual hormone-binding globulin: 34,7 nmol/l (15,0-103,0)

Prolactin getting higher, estrogene lowered, testo (fortunately) a little higher again. I've been taken zinc (50mg per day) for some weeks now, may help.

greets

[NewReg]

Jim,

I have suffered no ill affects taking IH's entire regimen and .5mg of propecia. As IH noted DIM is a good addition and one that I take as well along with maca to take care of the estrogen upswing.

How long have you been on this regiment?

[sublime9]

3 years

[1.....]

sublime how ur regime stopped your hairloss?

[sublime9]

It has stopped it.

[1.....]

nice! why do you take such a low dose of fin? did you get sides from a higher dose and do you get sides from it with the small dose?

[albe]

The fact that you're taking a low dose is probably irrelevant, as fin has a flat response past 0.1mg or so (at least with respect to DHT and other hormones).

I have the same issue with fin, and I just ordered Arimidex to try out (I was thinking 0.25mg 2-3x per week). I read some studies on animals, where the combination of aromatase inhibitors and 5-alpha-reductase inhibitors significantly raised testosterone. The feedback loop in humans should lead to the same response. I vaguely remember reading a study on hairlosshelp where this was done on humans, and led to a 200% rise in testosterone, but I can't find it online, so I'm not completely sure.

I'll post back in a while about this, once I've tested it. My initial thoughts are that this combination therapy could stop premature balding in a lot of young men, since it directly addresses the PCOS-like hormonal profile many of us have.