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Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  bov51 on Wed Oct 14, 2015 3:43 am

sanderson wrote:
bogv51 wrote:
Jrli80 wrote:He's right about that 10mg not being nearly enough. I'm sorry I misread and thought it was 10g.

Either way when I have some time Id call/email the company and see if what the price drop would be if we ordered maybe 50gs between a few of us.

If there is at least 3 people who are serious about moving forward with it.


call them up and see watsup, their company look pretty legit as for as purity is concern. The pricing is prolly going to be insane tho

Who cares about price.. how much would we need everyday?

10 mg-20 mg

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  Changexpert on Wed Oct 14, 2015 4:30 am

Prolactin also increases calcium absorption, inhibits calcium excretion. Makes so much sense why scalp would feel tight if calcification theory is correct.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17823618
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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  Changexpert on Wed Oct 14, 2015 4:37 am

Stress increases cortisol, which in turn increases prolactin. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1569828

One question I have is, can this be reversed? Can prolactin increase cortisol? I could not find anything that worked in this manner.

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  sanderson on Wed Oct 14, 2015 4:41 am

http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/calcium.shtml

Prolactin, which is increased under the influence of estrogen or serotonin, causes the body to lose calcium (drawing it from the bones), and it stimulates the secretion of PTH, which compensates for the calcium loss by increasing its mobilization from bones. Prolactins action on bone is at least partly by increasing IL-6 formation; IL-6 stimulates the release of prolactin. Serotonin and IL-6 stimulate each others secretion, and PTH and serotonin each stimulate the others release..

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  Changexpert on Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:00 am

sanderson wrote:http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/calcium.shtml

Prolactin, which is increased under the influence of estrogen or serotonin, causes the body to lose calcium (drawing it from the bones), and it stimulates the secretion of PTH, which compensates for the calcium loss by increasing its mobilization from bones. Prolactins action on bone is at least partly by increasing IL-6 formation; IL-6 stimulates the release of prolactin. Serotonin and IL-6 stimulate each others secretion, and PTH and serotonin each stimulate the others release..

I could not find a single study that pointed prolactin decreases serum calcium level initially, which would be the first logical step to increase PTH. Maybe prolactin just increases PTH without decreasing the serum calcium level initially. Excluding the first step of serum calcium loss, here is a synopsis of what happens with increase in prolactin.

1.
+ prolactin -> + pth -> + osteoclast -> + serum calcium -> + osteoblast -> - serum calcium -> increased calcium absorption in intestine -> + serum calcium
 
2.
+ prolactin -> - Ca excretion -> + serum calcium -> + osteoblast -> - serum calcium -> increased calcium absorption in intestine -> + serum calcium

Osteoclast = break down of bone (bone resorption) = calcium moves from bone to blood, resulting in increase of serum calcium
Osteoblast = building of the bone = calcium moves from blood to bone, serum calcium level decreases

If prolactin does result in serum calcium loss initially, then everything returns to its original level at the end. Here's the kicker. Every time bone breaks down and forms again, our body releases other enzymes/proteins. Recently, researchers have seen a relationship between these substances and osteoporosis (loss of calcium in the bone). The higher the bone turnover, the higher risk of osteoporosis (http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/128567-overview).

Continual elevation of prolactin results in increased bone turnover rate. Hypogonadism in male also results in increased bone resorption (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23395836). In a nutshell, prolactin results in accumulation of byproducts of bone turnover, increased IL6 response (inflammation), and increases serotonin. Increase in serotonin can inhibit dopamine, which can block prolactin inhibition pathway.
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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  sanderson on Wed Oct 14, 2015 10:44 am

Changexpert wrote:
sanderson wrote:http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/calcium.shtml

Prolactin, which is increased under the influence of estrogen or serotonin, causes the body to lose calcium (drawing it from the bones), and it stimulates the secretion of PTH, which compensates for the calcium loss by increasing its mobilization from bones. Prolactins action on bone is at least partly by increasing IL-6 formation; IL-6 stimulates the release of prolactin. Serotonin and IL-6 stimulate each others secretion, and PTH and serotonin each stimulate the others release..

I could not find a single study that pointed prolactin decreases serum calcium level initially, which would be the first logical step to increase PTH. Maybe prolactin just increases PTH without decreasing the serum calcium level initially. Excluding the first step of serum calcium loss, here is a synopsis of what happens with increase in prolactin.

1.
+ prolactin -> + pth -> + osteoclast -> + serum calcium -> + osteoblast -> - serum calcium -> increased calcium absorption in intestine -> + serum calcium
 
2.
+ prolactin -> - Ca excretion -> + serum calcium -> + osteoblast -> - serum calcium -> increased calcium absorption in intestine -> + serum calcium

Osteoclast = break down of bone (bone resorption) = calcium moves from bone to blood, resulting in increase of serum calcium
Osteoblast = building of the bone = calcium moves from blood to bone, serum calcium level decreases

If prolactin does result in serum calcium loss initially, then everything returns to its original level at the end. Here's the kicker. Every time bone breaks down and forms again, our body releases other enzymes/proteins. Recently, researchers have seen a relationship between these substances and osteoporosis (loss of calcium in the bone). The higher the bone turnover, the higher risk of osteoporosis (http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/128567-overview).

Continual elevation of prolactin results in increased bone turnover rate. Hypogonadism in male also results in increased bone resorption (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23395836). In a nutshell, prolactin results in accumulation of byproducts of bone turnover, increased IL6 response (inflammation), and increases serotonin. Increase in serotonin can inhibit dopamine, which can block prolactin inhibition pathway.

my understanding is prolactin increases when calcium goes low in order to get calcium to be extracted from the bones.
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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  Changexpert on Wed Oct 14, 2015 10:53 am

sanderson wrote:my understanding is prolactin increases when calcium goes low in order to get calcium to be extracted from the bones.
Think of (not so) exceptional cases like masturbation where prolactin level rises from external effort. Your body is constantly trying to accommodate for calcium loss in the bone.
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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  sanderson on Wed Oct 14, 2015 1:28 pm

Changexpert wrote:
sanderson wrote:my understanding is prolactin increases when calcium goes low in order to get calcium to be extracted from the bones.
Think of (not so) exceptional cases like masturbation where prolactin level rises from external effort. Your body is constantly trying to accommodate for calcium loss in the bone.

I think we are thinking the same thing? Calcium blood serum low -> prolactin increases to get more calcium from bones. If you have enough calcium from diet, I don't think it will go up.
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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  Changexpert on Thu Oct 15, 2015 12:09 am

sanderson wrote:
Changexpert wrote:
sanderson wrote:my understanding is prolactin increases when calcium goes low in order to get calcium to be extracted from the bones.
Think of (not so) exceptional cases like masturbation where prolactin level rises from external effort. Your body is constantly trying to accommodate for calcium loss in the bone.

I think we are thinking the same thing? Calcium blood serum low -> prolactin increases to get more calcium from bones. If you have enough calcium from diet, I don't think it will go up.
I could not find a study that suggested calcium loss from masturbation, but several blog sites mentioned that excessive masturbation can lead to calcium loss. Semen is composed of several minerals, including calcium, but the amount of calcium lost seems so frivolous at less than 1 mg per ejaculation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semen). Do you think that our body is sensitive enough to realize this change and release PTH? I wonder if some other mechanism is involved to lower calcium level after ejaculation.

Anyhow, long story short, prolactin increases bone turnover rate, serotonin dominance over dopamine, and decrease in sexual hormones (T level for males). All of these sound bad not only for hair loss, but also for general health.
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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  H4ir on Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:05 am

From my research pgd2 inhibiter's all tend to decrease pge2 also. I have never seen a substance that inhibited pgd2 whilst simultaneously increasing pge2. Pgd2 inhibitors tend to decrease inflammation whilst substances that increase pge2 tend to increase inflammation. So applying a pgd2 inhibitor mixed with a pge2 stimulator is like taking an anti inflammatory with a pro inflammatory substance....it dont make sense at all

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  longhair31 on Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:36 am

Is anyone trying this? Also does not lithium cloride affect the sentral nerve system?


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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  magic_gro on Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:01 pm

H4ir wrote:From my research pgd2 inhibiter's all tend to decrease pge2 also. I have never seen a substance that inhibited pgd2 whilst simultaneously increasing pge2. Pgd2 inhibitors tend to decrease inflammation whilst substances that increase pge2 tend to increase inflammation. So applying a pgd2 inhibitor mixed with a pge2 stimulator is like taking an anti inflammatory with a pro inflammatory substance....it dont make sense at all

That's why the idea is to apply exogenous PGE2 instead. Or castor oil. Yes, what you said does not make sense, but what Swiss says is not what you said (straw man fallacy).

longhair31 wrote:Is anyone trying this? Also does not lithium cloride affect the sentral nerve system?

I am trying this, but I am afraid of LiCl. They are just using LiCl once right after wounding. I am thinking of applying VPA (Valproic Acid) else in smaller concentration all the time. But VPA is an antiepilectic and anticonvulsant, so that scares me too.

The thing is, this is the bit where I am least sure about things: how to stimulate all the clusters of differentiation. For more on CD's, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cluster_of_differentiation

It seems like there's nothing that works well on all the relevant CD's.

Borrowing from another forum:


From Dr Cotsarelis findings:

activator => CD34 positive progenitor stem cells
inhibitor => CD200 high(downregulation of immunoactivity)
resultant =>CD49F high Extra cellular Matrix

=> hair growth

Valproic acid, Calicipotriol and Tretinoin tri-axis:

Valproic acid => CD34(UP) but CD200(DOWN)
Calcipotriol => CD200(UP) but CD49F(DOWN)
Tretinoin=> CD49F(UP) but CD34(DOWN)
Lithium Chloride => ???
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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  Ronald84 on Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:14 pm

What effect does peppermint oil have, studies have shown it to be more effective than minoxidil.

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  MikeGore on Fri Oct 16, 2015 11:11 pm

Okay, I wanna do this protocol. But before I can move on, we need to discuss side effects of all the things involved here.

Question
1-) Lithium Chloride completely safe? What if it gets in our eyes? Is this harmful for facial skin etc.
2-) Any estrogenic (gyno inducing) effects of any of the things listed?
3-) Which derma device is best to buy? Dermapen, Dermaroller, Derminator?

Has anyone began the protocol yet?

And I still don't know where to get most of these stuff? From the forum here, are they being sold somewhere online? Don't know where to get septipirant, and worried about the safety of this? Was this one oral or topical?

Thanks,

Mike

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  Elessar on Sat Oct 17, 2015 3:14 am

MikeGore wrote:Okay, I wanna do this protocol. But before I can move on, we need to discuss side effects of all the things involved here.

Question
1-) Lithium Chloride completely safe? What if it gets in our eyes? Is this harmful for facial skin etc.
2-) Any estrogenic (gyno inducing) effects of any of the things listed?
3-) Which derma device is best to buy? Dermapen, Dermaroller, Derminator?

Has anyone began the protocol yet?

And I still don't know where to get most of these stuff? From the forum here, are they being sold somewhere online? Don't know where to get septipirant, and worried about the safety of this? Was this one oral or topical?

Thanks,

Mike
Pretty much everything you need to know is answered at swiss's blogspot and ask.fm. (Atleast to get started with the full ghetto protocol).

A tip for anyone who are interested in this is to read through his whole ask.fm, after you done that, im 100% sure you are educated enough and will know how to get started yourself.


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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  MikeGore on Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:24 am

Well looking at the link I don't see anywhere to buy the setipiprant.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lithium-I-chloride-99-0-Analytical-Reagent-ACS-30g-/281753036608?hash=item4199ca2740
http://www.amazon.com/Premier-Research-Labs-Castor-237mL/dp/B0042D1F1E
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Heritage-Products-Castor-Hexane-Free/dp/B004JMF6TU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1445020343&sr=8-1&keywords=Castor+Oil+christ
http://shop.owndoc.com/product-list.php?Derminator-pg1-cid61.html
http://www.dermapenworld.com/
setipiprant ???

Wondering if the Heritage Castor Oil is good as Premier Research Labs Castor.

Why is Derminator better than Dermapen? Seriously, Dermapen "looks" better.




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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  Biffy on Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:05 am

Derminator is faster and superior (less pain, no tearing of the skin) and probably in the long run even cheaper (you just replace the needles) and you can set the preferred depth of the needles.

Just buy extra virgin castor oil, why are you complicating so much!? Setipriprant is available at private forums - everywhere else it is overpriced.

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  VikingJL on Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:59 am

If you're in the US, Target has castor oil USP for $1.25 per 2 ounces.

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  AgapeBerry on Sat Oct 17, 2015 8:01 am

MikeGore wrote:Okay, I wanna do this protocol. But before I can move on, we need to discuss side effects of all the things involved here.

Question
1-) Lithium Chloride completely safe? What if it gets in our eyes? Is this harmful for facial skin etc.
2-) Any estrogenic (gyno inducing) effects of any of the things listed?
3-) Which derma device is best to buy? Dermapen, Dermaroller, Derminator?

Has anyone began the protocol yet?

And I still don't know where to get most of these stuff? From the forum here, are they being sold somewhere online? Don't know where to get septipirant, and worried about the safety of this? Was this one oral or topical?

Thanks,

Mike


as most of this protocol is made of synthetic chemicals, side effects and safety are issues. you have to understand that this is pretty experimental stuff and can be dangerous if you don't do your research. swisstemples has done his research and though he probably knows what he's doing, it can be difficult to explain complex things and include every little step or precaution taken since a lot of it he probably doesn't need to consciously think about. read the ask.fm and await the updates to his blog and do your own research on these chemicals. and yes do not get LiCL in your eyes, a quick google search can tell you what to do if that happens.

i plan on doing this protocol (aside from dut, which isnt part of the protocol but is part of what swiss is taking) and will document it and share it eventually.

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  AgapeBerry on Sat Oct 17, 2015 4:12 pm

inhousepharmacy.vu has sulfa in stock right now. they were out just last week and said they didn't expect to get any more till mid-november, but no longer. looks like they're catching on to the sudden spike in demand.

has anyone successfully organized a groupbuy here before? that'd be a really great idea for a company, just organize group buys to ensure no one gets burned. wonder if you could use kickstarter for that.

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  sanderson on Sun Oct 18, 2015 1:21 am

toolsmakingtools wrote:inhousepharmacy.vu has sulfa in stock right now. they were out just last week and said they didn't expect to get any more till mid-november, but no longer. looks like they're catching on to the sudden spike in demand.

has anyone successfully organized a groupbuy here before? that'd be a really great idea for a company, just organize group buys to ensure no one gets burned. wonder if you could use kickstarter for that.

we need seti, not sulfa
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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  AgapeBerry on Sun Oct 18, 2015 4:39 am

sanderson wrote:
toolsmakingtools wrote:inhousepharmacy.vu has sulfa in stock right now. they were out just last week and said they didn't expect to get any more till mid-november, but no longer. looks like they're catching on to the sudden spike in demand.

has anyone successfully organized a groupbuy here before? that'd be a really great idea for a company, just organize group buys to ensure no one gets burned. wonder if you could use kickstarter for that.

we need seti, not sulfa

sulfa is cheaper and easier to acquire and what swisstemples got very fast regrowth using. it's not a permanent choice it's making due with what's available.

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  MikeGore on Sun Oct 18, 2015 7:27 am

Okay so if Septipirant is bought through forums, how do I go about and buying it? Where, who, when? I mean WTF, if someone talks about a protocol to follow it would help to layout where to get the stuff from, like put links, contact info. Something. Sorry, just getting a little impatient.

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  johndoe1225 on Sun Oct 18, 2015 7:57 am

MikeGore wrote:Okay so if Septipirant is bought through forums, how do I go about and buying it? Where, who, when? I mean WTF, if someone talks about a protocol to follow it would help to layout where to get the stuff from, like put links, contact info. Something. Sorry, just getting a little impatient.

To be fair, lots of people would probably then say he's in it for advertising/money Very Happy

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Re: Regrowth Protocol via PGE2... wow. Pics/Theory Included.

Post  sanderson on Sun Oct 18, 2015 8:17 am

toolsmakingtools wrote:
sanderson wrote:
toolsmakingtools wrote:inhousepharmacy.vu has sulfa in stock right now. they were out just last week and said they didn't expect to get any more till mid-november, but no longer. looks like they're catching on to the sudden spike in demand.

has anyone successfully organized a groupbuy here before? that'd be a really great idea for a company, just organize group buys to ensure no one gets burned. wonder if you could use kickstarter for that.

we need seti, not sulfa

sulfa is cheaper and easier to acquire and what swisstemples got very fast regrowth using. it's not a permanent choice it's making due with what's available.

it also causes your sperm count to go down......... i dont think you want to be messing with a drug that is not even on the market yet that has that as a documented side effect from a study
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