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Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

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Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  HairMeOut on Wed Jun 01, 2016 4:32 am

Think we can all agree there are few things more unsettling than losing your hair. The feeling of helplessness and being out of control are unpleasant to say the least.

I've been losing small patches of hair since about 2009. Only became aware of it when the hair stylist said I had a thinning patch. Ever since then, I've been somewhat OCD and self-conscious about it.

Have tried:

- Minoxidil
- Regentresse
- Home remedies
- Hair club for men! Kind of a waste of time and money, in my opinion. All they did was massage, shampoo and condition my hair, put it under a heat lamp, and give me minoxidil, shampoos and saw palmetto pills. Could have simply purchased all of that at 1/15th the cost they charged me.

So now, being fed up with the glowing patch at the back of my head and the thinning areas on top, I found this forum. I've been perusing the Detumescence thread here:

http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t10798p45-detumescence-really-works

Fascinating. Can you really grow your hair back simply by massaging it? It looks like people really are getting results, and aren't just selling something.

So I've started my journey to reclaiming my hair. Started 4 days ago. I intend this to be a progress thread with pictures to show for it. Thinking I will upload a new set of pictures every couple of weeks. Seems about right.

My question for anyone else who has done DT - did you stop using other products and techniques whilst doing it? I'm thinking I'll just stop using Rogaine while doing this. It hasn't grown back any of my hair. It may have halted loss, but it definitely has not filled in the patch of glory in my vertex region.

Will post some pics in my next post.


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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  johndoe1225 on Wed Jun 01, 2016 6:20 am

Check out cdto's DT CPR method, that's even better IMO, not to mention easier on your hands.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  HairMeOut on Wed Jun 01, 2016 9:57 am

johndoe1225 wrote:Check out cdto's DT CPR method, that's even better IMO, not to mention easier on your hands.

Thanks for that. I actually did read through most of it. He uses a bottle to press into the head, I believe. I may try it.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  SonofOdin on Wed Jun 01, 2016 11:35 am

Welcome to the forums. DT is a very high compliance regimen meaning, you're going to have to work for it, and be very self disciplined. The time investment is 40 min a day, split into two sections, 20 min morning, 20 min evening. Make sure you're willing to do this for at least 8 months without fail, to be able to assess if this regimen is for you.
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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  HairMeOut on Wed Jun 01, 2016 4:52 pm

SonofOdin wrote:Welcome to the forums. DT is a very high compliance regimen meaning, you're going to have to work for it, and be very self disciplined. The time investment is 40 min a day, split into two sections, 20 min morning, 20 min evening. Make sure you're willing to do this for at least 8 months without fail, to be able to assess if this regimen is for you.

Yes, I'm definitely on board with the commitment. Tired of seeing the hair thin, and nothing else I've tried seems to have stopped it. So - let's see what happens!

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  HairMeOut on Wed Jun 01, 2016 6:52 pm

Here are some starting pics with explanations:

Top view with front part of hair slightly parted in one section (bottom-right) to show thinning. This thinning occurs in most parts on the top of my head. Thinning has become more drastic over the past 8 months. It is especially prominent in the back of my head (see pics below)



Pic below is pretty much the same picture but shows more of the thinning happening at the back side of my head:



Pic below: there is actually more of a thinning spot here than shown. It only seems smaller because some of the hair is combed towards the right. See other pictures below for comparison.



Pic below shows more thinning in the vertex region:



To give more of an idea of general thinning, I combed my hair forward in the pic below. You can see "lines" of thinning:



Pic of the thinning patch from another angle. This is where it's most obvious to others:



Here is another picture of the top of my head, but this time with my hair "mussed up" (just messy, essentially). really brings out the thinning (ugly Sad ):



Thought it would be a good idea to take a picture of my hair wet, to emphasize thinning areas:



I also took video tonight, but will post that later.


Last edited by HairMeOut on Wed Jun 01, 2016 6:52 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Added in last sentence.)

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  Hotspur on Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:47 am

Don't wish to be negative, HMO, but I've yet to be convinced by DT. The study was most likely a fraud or flawed. The lead proponents of the technique have disappeared and multiple users have testified this technique has accelerated hair-loss.

I write this as someone who applied the technique -- Or my rendition of it -- for several months and spoke to the report author Henry Choy. In my view you'd be best advised to try other interventions.

Headstands have strong anecdotal support and general health benefits. Visit YouTube and watch a scalp massage technique called the 'Inversion Method'. Dramatically increase your intake of whole plant foods, fruits and vegetables (Check Sage's Thread...)

... All would likely yield a better results than DT.

I don't wish to be negative and good luck to all the guys trying this. I believe scalp massage, correctly applied, can be beneficial to hair-growth. However it's a developing science that will likely progressed by Rei Ogawa ... Not this approach.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  HairMeOut on Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:23 am

Hotspur wrote:Don't wish to be negative, HMO, but I've yet to be convinced by DT. The study was most likely a fraud or flawed. The lead proponents of the technique have disappeared and multiple users have testified this technique has accelerated hair-loss.

I write this as someone who applied the technique -- Or my rendition of it -- for several months and spoke to the report author Henry Choy. In my view you'd be best advised to try other interventions.

Headstands have strong anecdotal support and general health benefits. Visit YouTube and watch a scalp massage technique called the 'Inversion Method'. Dramatically increase your intake of whole plant foods, fruits and vegetables (Check Sage's Thread...)

... All would likely yield a better results than DT.

I don't wish to be negative and good luck to all the guys trying this. I believe scalp massage, correctly applied, can be beneficial to hair-growth. However it's a developing science that will likely progressed by Rei Ogawa ... Not this approach.

I'm not taking as negative - it's healthy skepticism. I also have yet to convince myself it works. But in my view, the best way (and the only way) for me to see if it works for me is to do it. If I wait for others to convince me it works before I try it, I'll just be waiting around doing nothing, when I could be doing the exercises and possibly gaining. If I gain nothing, no harm.

I've seen enough evidence from others to convince me this isn't just some snake oil salesman old wive's tale. The people showing the before and after pictures have nothing to gain from me monetarily. They aren't selling something - which tells me I should at least pay attention to their results.

But I appreciate the skepticism. I, too, am skeptical. But I'm giving it a go, nonetheless. There is no other way to experience it other than trying it!

I read up on Inversion Method. Seems pretty similar to DT in they both get blood to the scalp. I may or may not include this in my regimen for the next few months.

One thing I've noticed right away - my hair looks a lot more stylish and full after doing the scalp massages! I looked in the mirror and thought "Damn... never knew I could do that with my hair. Looks fine!" Almost look like a 50s character who needs a leather jacket and pocket comb. :-)

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  HairMeOut on Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:37 am

Think I'm going to take a break for a day. My scalp feels very raw, and in need of rest from the daily massages. Have been sticking with it religiously. Will pick up again tomorrow.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  cdto2012 on Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:54 am

Glad you are being sensitive to your body and proceeding at a healthy pace. I will say something for the younger guys that I have learned recently. As I lost most of my hair I tried to hold on to what I had left. I think that most guys in their 40's are pretty ugly to start with, never mind if they have a shaved bald head.
My hair also felt better after a few weeks. Perhaps the firming of the skin made the hairs stand up better. I started shaving my head at different times. Now that I have done it and have gotten really positive feedback from ladies and friends about how good it looks, I could live with it mostly shaved.
In reality my regrow plus the few grafts looks a bit like I might have somewhat normal hair on top. When I shave away the gray side hairs and horseshoe in the back, it just looks cleaner and the ladies like it. I live in Thailand anyway, so it is all kind of irrelevant to worry about ladies ever.
The point is that even if you end up with very little hair in the end naturally - or by experimenting - address your fears early on. The process of regrow is slow and takes work, and your attitude and emotional state will make the difference regarding hanging in there until something works for you.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  Reborn Hair PPP on Fri Jul 01, 2016 7:44 pm

HairMeOut wrote:Think I'm going to take a break for a day. My scalp feels very raw, and in need of rest from the daily massages. Have been sticking with it religiously. Will pick up again tomorrow.

Hey HairMeOut,

I would say you are on the right track. Two things I would add are the following: 1.5mm dermaroller once every 2 weeks and onion, garlic, and apple cider vinegar everyday for 1 hour with a shower cap or leave overnight.

I have had some decent regrowth on my temples and crown. Please check out the before and videos below:

1. Temples: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_-qGI1b15Y
2. Crown: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prbKTsDfuj8

If you are curious to know how to properly and vigorously massage your head like DT, I have put a compilation here:
1. Part 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL-KzAvkK_s
2. Part 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olOwbnNDHbk
3. Part 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wUmvE9cSRrQ

Let me know pal, if you have any questions! Keep up the steady work!

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  Joey Ramone on Sat Jul 02, 2016 2:04 pm

Hey man, appreciate the videos. Congrats on the progress.

Does your scalp get overworked with the dermaroller? Seems like something better to take up after a couple of months of dt when the scalp adjusts.

Also every day with acv, vinegar, garlic? I tried it once for an hour and spent the next three days smelling like salad dressing. No way I could do that and have a girl over. Are you planning to keep it up til full regrowth?

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  johndoe1225 on Sun Jul 03, 2016 2:05 am

Hey Reborn could you please link me to the video on how to make the ACV garlic and onion topical? I thought I favorited it but I can't find it so I guess not.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  Reborn Hair PPP on Fri Jul 08, 2016 8:08 pm

Joey Ramone wrote:Hey man, appreciate the videos. Congrats on the progress.

Does your scalp get overworked with the dermaroller? Seems like something better to take up after a couple of months of dt when the scalp adjusts.

Also every day with acv, vinegar, garlic? I tried it once for an hour and spent the next three days smelling like salad dressing. No way I could do that and have a girl over. Are you planning to keep it up til full regrowth?

Hey Joey,

Sorry for the late response.

I don't think my scalp gets overworked with the dermaroller. It may seem like I am applying many strokes on each region, but I never perform DR concurrently with DT. Thanks to you, I am actually even remaining DR idle for about 6 weeks because I think performing it more frequently can disrupt the collagen regrowth cycle. However, I seemed to still be getting decent results even waiting about 2-3 weeks until my next session.

About the onion and garlic treatment, I understand your concern. I am at a point where I feel like I am going to vomit because even my sweat smells disgusting. What I do to conceal the smell is add about 2-3 drops of lavender oil in a 4oz glass bottle diluted with water. I then spray it on my scalp and leave it on for 5 mins before washing it out. It actually really helps and even though I can sometimes smell the garlic, my friends or family cannot smell it for some odd reason. Very Happy

I have been performing the onion and garlic topical for about a month and I think my existing vellus hairs are actually growing longer, darker, and thicker. I don't want to get my hopes too high and wishfully think this is happening, so I am going to be a little more patient and stick it through for the next 5 months to see where this takes me.

In the end, I am just trying all natural remedies so I can easily rule out the ones which are not profitable.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  Reborn Hair PPP on Fri Jul 08, 2016 8:20 pm

johndoe1225 wrote:Hey Reborn could you please link me to the video on how to make the ACV garlic and onion topical?  I thought I favorited it but I can't find it so I guess not.

Hey Johndoe,

Sorry again for the late response.

Preparation is easy. I would advise for maximum effectiveness, use a new batch everyday since garlic and onion can lose its potency and effectiveness when left stagnant for a couple of days. Please follow the steps to prepare one batch of this topical which is plenty to marinate on your scalp:
1. Cut a small red onion in half. Cut the half onion in four quarters and place in a blender
2. Cut three cloves of garlic and place in a blender
3. 3 tbls of water and 1 tbls of apple cider vinegar in a blender
4. Once the concoction is blender, it should look thick and pasty
5. Get a bottle with an eye dropper since it's easier to apply on scalp and place a funnel on top of the bottle opener
6. Place a paper towel on top of the funnel and pour the paste onto the paper towel. Make sure the paper towel is thick enough to prevent breakage.
7. Crumble or fold the paper towel and use it as a means to squeeze the juice out of the paste and into the funnel. This way, the concentrated juice will flow into the glass bottle easily without spillage.

If you need the video as a visual, check out stephan's video on youtube here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUIFiCY4gIs

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  sandeep_1234 on Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:09 am

Can some one help withe the links or videos on how to perform massage using detumescence therapy

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  cdto2012 on Mon Jan 29, 2018 3:13 pm

Hi I suppose there are some old links around such as this classic one that covers more traditional methods of massage, but maybe better to check you tube for method first.
http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t9446-detumescence-therapy-dedicated-volunteers-wanted?highlight=volunteers

On this page is a recent summary of the hard pressing DT-CPR method that has worked for me and has progress photos for the last few years.
http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t12501p25-whats-the-final-verdict-on-dt?highlight=verdict

main thread (long but full of research and content )

http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t11746p625-regrowth-photos-dt-cpr-method

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  sandeep_1234 on Mon Jan 29, 2018 5:42 pm

Hi Thanks for the reply but i am not able to find any links or videos which describes how the massage should be performed and also could you please share the videos and links on how to perform hard pressing DT-CPR method

Thanks





cdto2012 wrote:Hi I suppose there are some old links around such as this classic one that covers more traditional methods of massage, but maybe better to check you tube for method first.
http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t9446-detumescence-therapy-dedicated-volunteers-wanted?highlight=volunteers

On this page is a recent summary of the hard pressing DT-CPR method that has worked for me and has progress photos for the last few years.  
http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t12501p25-whats-the-final-verdict-on-dt?highlight=verdict

main thread (long but full of research and content )

http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t11746p625-regrowth-photos-dt-cpr-method

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  cdto2012 on Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:25 pm

from the second thread listed,   worth reading the context post and other options, such as brushing method also
http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t12501p25-whats-the-final-verdict-on-dt?highlight=verdict


"  - Use a rounded edge of a vitamin bottle (beginners)  or open edge of a PVC elbow to make 1/2 inch circles while pressing . Not rubbing the skin, but grinding the skin against the scalp.  The pressure amount is about the weight of your head, 15 pounds. Two to three times a day,  15- 30 minute sessions.  

- The decalcification benefits are one aspect, along with the circulation and bulging of veins.. The third aspect is the mild injury, this comes in a form of a soreness that lasts maybe 6-12 hours and is only felt if scalp is massaged. If you were to try to massage again, you would feel the mild soreness like it is not time to massage again yet. In the beginning I recommend the 3 times a day, because the sharp pain can keep you from reaching this level with one 20 minute massage. I use the rounded edge of the PVC elbow flat on my scalp, it really presses deep and is unflexable, but feels great.

There should never be bruising of the skin, just after around 20 minutes you will get used to reaching the mild soreness, This is very different from the piercing painful spots. The mild injury is what causes electron charge elevation (also PH change), platlet rich plasma, and regeneration stem cells to populate the area. I mention this to include the checklist in your duration and evaluation of your methods. Also try to do the entire scalp, to stimulate the lower vessels to bulge. "

If you feel sharp pains, progress in pressure gradually, after a month or so the sharp pains are removed

Cover as much of the scalp as possible, including the sides of scalp.  I use cinnamon oil on a dry scalp. Recently I use a tea of green tea, bit of seaweed,  watered down wasabi from Japan, and a bit of ascorbic acid vitamin C.  Applied to a scalp cleaned with vodka on a towel after wire brushing,  but would be fine with any treatment.  I will post updated photos soon.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  stronghands on Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:54 pm

Hi cdto2012,
I'm currently following your protocol (two 10 minutes session a day). I've bought a PVC elbow. What I feel is that it is very painful. I mean, even using just the pad of the fingers on my scalp and putting some pressure on the vertex, it is also painful. This is due to the calcification right? But it is not that painful on the sides and back.
Also do you do the whole scalp in each session, or you divide in sections per session?

Thanks for your time.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  cdto2012 on Thu Feb 01, 2018 6:36 am

The rounded bottom edge of the vitamin bottle is a bit softer for beginners. I do the whole scalp every session. If you are in a rush, you can do some kind of rolling on the sides. The sides are to push the blood in the larger veins around.

Yes the sharp painful areas are thought to be calification crystals and usually are where you are losing hair. That most guys find this to be the case, the theory makes sense. Getting rid of the crystals is the first phase. Also if you are doing short sessions, make sure that you are seeing you scalp or temple veins bulge at least. Dont overdo it with the pain, and try to establish a pace where you can last for months.

Best of luck and hope you also see some nice results soon. Your scalp can expel junk oils and your hair can feel much bouncier in a few weeks.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  cdto2012 on Thu Feb 01, 2018 1:53 pm

I should mention the need for vitamin C during the process.  You need your veins and tissue to be recovering quickly and stay elastic.  At least 1000- 2000 mg daily is recommended.  You can use the cheap ascorbic acid powder from amazon, and buffer it with 50% baking soda if you are concerned about the acid.  The acid actually detoxes heavy metals and chelates the calcification away also.

Hyperdoses of vitamin C have kept me from getting sick in the last 2 years. Best thing I have come across, and Caustic Symmetry approved.  



http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t9718-ascorbic-acid-vitamin-c-what-s-the-real-story?highlight=real+story

I did want to mention that my friend is an X ray tech.  I was talking about hair loss and calcification.  He said that he can see the deposits in the brain as people age.  Posters have shared you tube video of calcifiation deposit surgical removal from the scalp. This is a real thing and effects people in many ways.

Here is the key to why the mild injury of the pressing ( or wire brushing ) works. The body responds with wound healing platelet rich blood cells that have growth factors, stimulate stem cells, and offer other regenerative compounds.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4622412/ ( recently posted on the stem cell injection thread, but were covered in depth in my long thread also )

" Proponents of platelet-rich plasma (PRP) technology suggest that its benefits include an increase in hard- and soft-tissue wound healing. In addition, the role of PRP for the treatment of alopecia (areata and androgenic) has been demonstrated in recent reports [2–4]. The activation of platelet α−granules releases numerous growth factors, including transforming growth factor (TGF), platelet-derived growth factor (PDGF),vascular endothelial growth factor (VEGF), epidermal growth factor (EGF), insulin-like growth factor, and interleukin-1 [3]. It is proposed that growth factors released from platelets may act on stem cells in the bulge area of the follicles, stimulating the development of new follicles and promoting neovascularization [3]. In fact, in the bulge area, primitive stem cells of ectodermal origin are found, giving origin to epidermal cells and sebaceous glands. In matrix, germinative cells of mesenchymal origin are found at the dermal papilla. Interactions between these two kinds of cells as well as with binding growth factors (PDGF, TGF-β, and VEGF) activate the proliferative phase of the hair, giving rise to the future follicular unit [1] "


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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  Hairbeback on Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:31 pm

cdto2012 wrote:I should mention the need for vitamin C during the process.  You need your veins and tissue to be recovering quickly and stay elastic.  At least 1000- 2000 mg daily is recommended.  You can use the cheap ascorbic acid powder from amazon, and buffer it with 50% baking soda if you are concerned about the acid.  The acid actually detoxes heavy metals and chelates the calcification away also.

Hyperdoses of vitamin C have kept me from getting sick in the last 2 years. Best thing I have come across, and Caustic Symmetry approved.  



http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t9718-ascorbic-acid-vitamin-c-what-s-the-real-story?highlight=real+story

I did want to mention that my friend is an X ray tech.  I was talking about hair loss and calcification.  He said that he can see the deposits in the brain as people age.  Posters have shared you tube video of calcifiation deposit surgical removal from the scalp. This is a real thing and effects people in many ways.

Here is the key to why the mild injury of the pressing  ( or wire brushing ) works. The body responds with wound healing platelet rich blood cells that have growth factors,  stimulate stem cells, and offer other regenerative compounds.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4622412/   ( recently posted on the stem cell injection thread, but were covered in depth in my long thread also )

"  Proponents of platelet-rich plasma (PRP) technology suggest that its benefits include an increase in hard- and soft-tissue wound healing. In addition, the role of PRP for the treatment of alopecia (areata and androgenic) has been demonstrated in recent reports [2–4]. The activation of platelet α−granules releases numerous growth factors, including transforming growth factor (TGF), platelet-derived growth factor (PDGF),vascular endothelial growth factor (VEGF), epidermal growth factor (EGF), insulin-like growth factor, and interleukin-1 [3]. It is proposed that growth factors released from platelets may act on stem cells in the bulge area of the follicles, stimulating the development of new follicles and promoting neovascularization [3]. In fact, in the bulge area, primitive stem cells of ectodermal origin are found, giving origin to epidermal cells and sebaceous glands. In matrix, germinative cells of mesenchymal origin are found at the dermal papilla. Interactions between these two kinds of cells as well as with binding growth factors (PDGF, TGF-β, and VEGF) activate the proliferative phase of the hair, giving rise to the future follicular unit [1]  "

This was the conclusion I came to then I was made fun out of by Xenon and bashed. Don't forget vitamin k2 and vitamin e also. I am probably going to get my vitamin c from fruits

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  cdto2012 on Thu Feb 01, 2018 6:52 pm

Fruits generally have no where near the amount of vitamin C needed to get life changing results. A glass of orange juice has around 70 mg of vitamin C. To reverse an oncoming cold or flu I need around 10,000 mg every 4 hours, it is usually enough after 8 hours.

Our body needs more C than we realize and until you get into high doses you will not know what you are missing. This research is backed by Linus Pauling a 2 time Nobel Prize winner for science. It is safe, cheap, well researched, and easy to do. What will people do when given such knowledge ? Probably nothing, that is why I don't publish too often on this forum. Even the simplest things people don't have time for or are too focused on a fad that does not last.

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Re: Hair GAIN Through Detumescence Therapy

Post  Hairbeback on Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:50 pm

cdto2012 wrote:Fruits generally have no where near the amount of vitamin C needed to get life changing results.  A glass of orange juice has around 70 mg of vitamin C.   To reverse an oncoming cold or flu I need around 10,000 mg every 4 hours,  it is usually enough after 8 hours.

Our body needs more C than we realize and until you get into high doses you will not know what you are missing.  This research is backed by Linus Pauling a 2 time Nobel Prize winner for science.  It is safe, cheap, well researched, and easy to do. What will people do when given such knowledge ?  Probably nothing, that is why I don't publish too often on this forum.  Even the simplest things people don't have time for or are too focused on a fad that does not last.  

sources?

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