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Official Vegan Thread

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Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Mon Aug 22, 2016 3:55 pm

The purpose of this thread is to help people transition into a healthier lifestyle that will benefit their hair and lifespan.
Inflammation has been shown to play a part in androgenic alopecia. By improving one's diet, inflammation can be eliminated. The vegan diet is a diet high in sugar,carbohydrates, fiber,resistant starch, phytonutrients, MYCONUTRIENTS,minerals,vitamins, electrolytes, biophotons, enzymes, antioxidants-substances that are crucial for maintaining health. It is also low in dangerous suibstances-methionine, dioxins, protein, fat, bacteria, acrylamide, pesticides, heterocyclic amines, heavy metals, PCBs, rancid oils, cholesterol, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, and antibiotics.

In this thread I'll be debunking Weston A Price and others who continue to post pseudoscience even after Michael Greger's outstanding research. This is the best way to regrow your hair. I'll agree that WAP's high-meat diet is ostentatious, but it is nothing more than that since it has zero nutritive qualities. After being tricked by their lies, you will reap the atrocious diseases that science has long associated with meat eating. Many say that "digestible protein" is one of the merits of the paleo diet, but a diet that is unnecessarily high in protein will destroy your future. I have to give it credit for encouraging people to eat more vegetables, but the benefit will only be momentary and meat will allow ill-health and rapid hairloss to have an encore. There is overwhelming evidence of this. It is time to bury the belief that meat is healthy. The high quantity of meats is the Achilles heel of Paleolithic, Ketogenic, and Peatarian diets. What is often said to be a "ketogenic flu" is in fact the prelude to the cancer, alzheimers, hairloss, and devastation that are to come if one is not yet discouraged by eating ketogenic.

For those who have tried CS's supplements, DT, propecia, and/or LLLT, this diet is all that remains. I thought that only hope remained for me, but there are still options for us.
~Questions and Answers~


-Okay, that sounds cool, but where can I learn about creating the perfect diet?
http://www.30bananasaday.com/
https://www.drfuhrman.com/
https://www.drmcdougall.com/
http://nutritionfacts.org/
-Should I take any supplements?
b12
-Will I get any deficiencies? Protein deficiency?
There is no such thing. Protein causes aging of the hair follicle. Plant foods have enough protein anyways. The man who fasted for 382 days did not become protein deficient. It's very near impossible to become deficient in any vitamin,mineral, or phytoantioxidant on a vegan diet. When you eat remove empty calories like oil, you are able to eat more nutrient dense foods like brown rice and whole wheat. Plant foods are always the most nutrient dense too.
-Have you regrown your hair on this regimen?
Yes.
-Are there any side effects?
Hair regrowth, increased strength, increased energy, eyesight improvements, happiness to list a few. It is common to feel like you're 10 years younger. As the Earth rotates you'll feel like you're getting younger, rather than older. This is because the antioxidants will be healing your hair and body from radical oxygen species damage. You will be able to live as long the longest people in the world, Seventh Day Adventists. Vegans are living the longest.
-Can I eat fish?
No. Fish is too high in PCBs. Studies have shown time after time that going from a regular diet to pescetarian has benefits. Going from pescetarian to vegan has more benefits. The less meat you eat, the more your body and hair rejuvenates.
-My libido's as strong as thirty years ago, my eyesight is improving, I feel stronger, I feel happier, I found a girlfriend and my dreams have come true. Thank you.
Don't thank me, thank yourself for listening to logic and science. I only made a thread, you are the one that changed to a cruelty-free diet.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:19 am


This is the latest research by Michael Greger.
If you've been studying nutrition and its effect on the hair, you already know about IGF1 and the dangers of protein. It's not surprising how time and time again science agrees with a plant-based diet. There's so much evidence behind veganism that I don't know why people on the paleolithic diet ignore it.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Thu Aug 25, 2016 7:22 pm

Are you a Peatarian? You should make the switch now.
What's wrong with a Peat diet?
1.Processed foods and other low nutrient foods - sugar, oil, juice, white rice, honey,soda, and possibly gelatin. Coconut oil is the worst oil to eat. If you ate 2400 calories of it, you would not get 5% of your RDA of any micronutrients. Almost every micronutrient would be 0%. This is almost the same for other oils. At least EVOO would give you 100%+ vitamin E and K1(0% in most of everything else still). There are some healthy alternatives to oil like  avocados, nuts and seeds(and olives, whole coconuts)
2.Lack of nutrients
Whole grains are the most nutrient dense food on the planet. For example, 2400 calories of kale would give you about 300% in almost in every micronutrient and up to 16,000% of the RDA. The longest living people, Okinawans, Seventhday Adventists, and vegans, eat loads of whole grains. Whole grains are even more important for people who eat processed Peatarian foods since they're already at a very low micronutrient diet. They need even more grains and legumes to compensate for the lack of nutrients in their diet. Usually getting enough calories in a day on a whole foods diet would give you 200%+ in most micronutrients. On a Peat diet it's going to be harder to not become deficient since the foods have too few vitamins and minerals.
3. Lack of variety
Go vegan and you'll have access to 100+grains,nuts,seeds,fruits,and vegetables. The lack of variety is probably why they turn to processed foods in the first place.



This isn't to say that high fat or high protein diets though. This is just the first step into regrowing hair, a nutrient dense diet.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  Hotspur on Thu Aug 25, 2016 10:12 pm

I agree the vegan diet is the optimal diet for health. That doesn't necessarily it's the optimal diet for hair health.

You'll find many men and women -- Young and old -- who have lost hair long after beginning a vegan diet. A better question to ask is which vegan diet is optimal? I personally steer my diet towards Joel Furhman's nutritarian diet.

As an aside, wouldn't be great to have a NutritionFacts.org style website for hair-loss sufferers? I like Danny Roddy's content but I don't agree with all of his views -- Or more specifically his citations -- on cholesterol, etc.

This is something we hair-loss sufferers should crowdfund 1 day ...

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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Fri Aug 26, 2016 2:23 pm

Hotspur wrote:I agree the vegan diet is the optimal diet for health. That doesn't necessarily it's the optimal diet for hair health.

You'll find many men and women -- Young and old -- who have lost hair long after beginning a vegan diet. A better question to ask is which vegan diet is optimal? I personally steer my diet towards Joel Furhman's nutritarian diet.

As an aside, wouldn't be great to have a NutritionFacts.org style website for hair-loss sufferers? I like Danny Roddy's content but I don't agree with all of his views -- Or more specifically his citations -- on cholesterol, etc.

This is something we hair-loss sufferers should crowdfund 1 day ...
Danny Roddy and other peatarians are fiber deficient. There are many different types of fiber and each one has miraculous benefits on the hair. Beta-glucans are another example of a beneficial fiber that rejuvenates the immune system.
Whole grains are extremely important if you want to live past the age of 100 and grow your hair back.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  Hotspur on Fri Aug 26, 2016 5:08 pm

Can you provide us with a few examples of people who've regrown their hair on a vegan diet?

I think it's true a well planned plant based diet can slow or halt the progression of hair-loss. I've rarely seen examples of people who've actually regrown significant hair on a vegan diet though ...

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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  sanderson on Sun Aug 28, 2016 3:23 am

john3333 wrote:Are you a Peatarian? You should make the switch now.
What's wrong with a Peat diet?
1.Processed foods and other low nutrient foods - sugar, oil, juice, white rice, honey,soda, and possibly gelatin. Coconut oil is the worst oil to eat. If you ate 2400 calories of it, you would not get 5% of your RDA of any micronutrients. Almost every micronutrient would be 0%. This is almost the same for other oils. At least EVOO would give you 100%+ vitamin E and K1(0% in most of everything else still). There are some healthy alternatives to oil like  avocados, nuts and seeds(and olives, whole coconuts)
2.Lack of nutrients
Whole grains are the most nutrient dense food on the planet. For example, 2400 calories of kale would give you about 300% in almost in every micronutrient and up to 16,000% of the RDA. The longest living people, Okinawans, Seventhday Adventists, and vegans, eat loads of whole grains. Whole grains are even more important for people who eat processed Peatarian foods since they're already at a very low micronutrient diet. They need even more grains and legumes to compensate for the lack of nutrients in their diet. Usually getting enough calories in a day on a whole foods diet would give you 200%+ in most micronutrients. On a Peat diet it's going to be harder to not become deficient since the foods have too few vitamins and minerals.
3. Lack of variety
Go vegan and you'll have access to 100+grains,nuts,seeds,fruits,and vegetables. The lack of variety is probably why they turn to processed foods in the first place.



This isn't to say that high fat or high protein diets though. This is just the first step into regrowing hair, a nutrient dense diet.

are you kidding me? eggs, milk, liver, oysters, bone broth has no nutrients? it was way more nutrient dense than any other diet. coconut oil is the healthiest.. it mimics the state of your body... look at it, in the hot weather, it turns to liquid. you think gluten is good for you??? WTF??
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  Xenon on Sun Aug 28, 2016 5:30 am

you think gluten is good for you??? WTF??

What I noticed about grains / gluten (experimented with them a short while ago to observe side effects), they cause incredible heat retention prior to inflammation kicking in. It's like my body and scalp is trying to sweat but cannot, and consequently starts suffering hyperthermia. The sensation is nasty, and I can only describe it as something akin to a fever. I have no idea why such foods promote such a response.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  jadegreg on Sun Aug 28, 2016 5:50 am

John333, whilst I wish you the best with your hair loss, and your endeavours to make yourself a healthier person, you really must present ideas from others than just Michael Gregor, who I might add is certainly no researcher (i.e. no background in research, unlike the controversial Ray Peat), and has no background in nutrition. This is of course, not to say he's not a bright chap. Many vegan scientists on the web, even suggest he plays a bit fast and loose with interpretations of the data in his 'micro-reports' i.e. Seventh Day Adventists. Whilst I have not sat through many of his sound bites and checked the veracity of said studies he cites, in my opinion his interpretations of the Okinawa diet study are questionable. Although I have not done this myself, it might be worthwhile to check out the source material he presents and see whether any of the studies themselves are worth their salt, before accepting his, or any other 'researchers' ideas as a 'given'.

On a side note, I can assure you much research done in the name of science is 'piss poor', and shouldn't even be published, with many glaring omissions/misrepresentations of background literature to the theoretical question or approach, poor experimental design, use of inappropriate statistical methods, imperfect/biased interpretation, or just misrepresentation, of the data etc. At the end of the day no scientific studies provide 'proof' for any theoretical question, just weak or strong evidence based on the qualities of said studies.

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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  sanderson on Sun Aug 28, 2016 6:11 am

Xenon wrote:
you think gluten is good for you??? WTF??

What I noticed about grains / gluten (experimented with them a short while ago to observe side effects), they cause incredible heat retention prior to inflammation kicking in. It's like my body and scalp is trying to sweat but cannot, and consequently starts suffering hyperthermia. The sensation is nasty, and I can only describe it as something akin to a fever. I have no idea why such foods promote such a response.

yeah i'm not sure what it does either. i mean, it is a carb, carbs will increase your body temp for sure.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:30 pm

sanderson wrote:
are you kidding me? eggs, milk, liver, oysters, bone broth has no nutrients? it was way more nutrient dense than any other diet. coconut oil is the healthiest.. it mimics the state of your body... look at it, in the hot weather, it turns to liquid. you think gluten is good for you??? WTF??
Oysters and seafood are too high in toxins.
Gluten grains are good for most people. They have hundreds of antioxidants. CS has talked about one antioxidant found in wheat, lignans. Phytic acid, which is sold as a supplement, is another antioxidant missing from a Peatarian diet that has a wide range of benefits including protection against cancer.  Wheat has anti-cancer properties.
Vegan diets are proven to cure heart disease, while Peatarian diets may cause heart attacks. If someone gets a heart attack on a diet, the diet may not be such a good one.
https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/i-had-a-heart-attack-on-sat-22-8-2015.7621/
It's not surprising since saturated fat clogged the arteries of eskimos.
The people who will beat Jeanne Calment have already been born and they are vegans. One of those vegans might be this young 70 year old vegan. Wait a few years for the older raw vegans to make it to the age of 100+ with a full head of hair. This is what happens when you follow a diet based on scientific evidence, not just hope.
If Jeanne Calment ate coconut oil instead of olive oil she would have died at 80 since coconut oil has no micronutrients.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gZ4U3V5LEc
CS's supplements are extracts that can be found in foods, including plants.
All of my friends who are interested in health eat whole grains and legumes. The other people who eat meat with salads and fruit are overweight. Everyone interested in longevity and who spends loads of their days reading studies tends to eat a diet that lowers IGF1 and low in protein. When you disagree with me, you're disagreeing with the majority of people interested in health. It's common knowledge that processed foods, which include oil and butter, are unhealthy.
Grains are not much different from vegetables. They are both rich in minerals and phytonutrients.
Plant foods contain beta-sitosterol, and so they are hairgrowth-promoting.
Edit: I forgot to say that I went mostly gluten-free for three years since everybody said it was bad. I realized it's actually a superfood and just another normal safe grain and have added it back into my diet. Since adding it back into my diet, I have not experienced any increased hairloss or inflammation.






I'm not saying a vegan diet is perfect. The perfect one would be raw vegan of course. Liquidarian diet is good too especially for beginners.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  sanderson on Sun Aug 28, 2016 4:01 pm

john3333 wrote:
sanderson wrote:
are you kidding me? eggs, milk, liver, oysters, bone broth has no nutrients? it was way more nutrient dense than any other diet. coconut oil is the healthiest.. it mimics the state of your body... look at it, in the hot weather, it turns to liquid. you think gluten is good for you??? WTF??
Oysters and seafood are too high in toxins.
Gluten grains are good for most people. They have hundreds of antioxidants. CS has talked about one antioxidant found in wheat, lignans. Phytic acid, which is sold as a supplement, is another antioxidant missing from a Peatarian diet that has a wide range of benefits including protection against cancer.  Wheat has anti-cancer properties.
Vegan diets are proven to cure heart disease, while Peatarian diets may cause heart attacks. If someone gets a heart attack on a diet, the diet may not be such a good one.
https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/i-had-a-heart-attack-on-sat-22-8-2015.7621/
It's not surprising since saturated fat clogged the arteries of eskimos.
The people who will beat Jeanne Calment have already been born and they are vegans. One of those vegans might be this young 70 year old vegan. Wait a few years for the older raw vegans to make it to the age of 100+ with a full head of hair. This is what happens when you follow a diet based on scientific evidence, not just hope.
If Jeanne Calment ate coconut oil instead of olive oil she would have died at 80 since coconut oil has no micronutrients.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gZ4U3V5LEc
CS's supplements are extracts that can be found in foods, including plants.
All of my friends who are interested in health eat whole grains and legumes. The other people who eat meat with salads and fruit are overweight. Everyone interested in longevity and who spends loads of their days reading studies tends to eat a diet that lowers IGF1 and low in protein. When you disagree with me, you're disagreeing with the majority of people interested in health. It's common knowledge that processed foods, which include oil and butter, are unhealthy.
Grains are not much different from vegetables. They are both rich in minerals and phytonutrients.
Plant foods contain beta-sitosterol, and so they are hairgrowth-promoting.
Edit: I forgot to say that I went mostly gluten-free for three years since everybody said it was bad. I realized it's actually a superfood and just another normal safe grain and have added it back into my diet. Since adding it back into my diet, I have not experienced any increased hairloss or inflammation.






I'm not saying a vegan diet is perfect. The perfect one would be raw vegan of course. Liquidarian diet is good too especially for beginners.

good points. the fact that someone ages barely anything on the vegan diet is a big draw for me and something i've thought about a lot. it's clear ray peat isn't aging any better than them. from a female perspective, i think the raw vegan diet would work well, but it's interesting the effects of it. i work with a woman who is a vegan, i will not lie, she does look young for her age without a doubt. without a doubt. she looks good. she's in her 40s, maybe even 50s actually. however, her temperature is very, very low. one time i felt her hand, it felt like ice cold.

it's clear her thyroid wasn't working well on the diet. why? probably not enough carbs. we all care about hair here, so really at the end of the day, who cares as long as it keeps hair right? well that is honestly the dillemma. i don't know the cause of hair loss.

i think the vegan diet probably makes you age better because you are releasing less insulin for one. fruit doesn't spike insulin very high compared to regular sugar. the thing is with fructose versus regular sugar. however, on the peat diet, the big insulin spiker is dairy. but his major carb is also fruit juice, so he has that going for him. however, peat is also utilizing thyroid hormone to handle the insulin load. i think the insulin will still go very high with dairy and thyroid won't be able to really stop it though, it still will spike high no matter what.

really, i don't understand hair loss, i don't think anyone does.

it seems like a big problem is PGD2 as being high in scalps with balding. for sake of argument, let's say that this is the cause of hair loss. this is essentially PUFA causing this. PUFA is the precursor to it being created. PUFA accumulates in your fat cells when you eat those bad oils. i mean, basically ray peat diet is making you lower cortisol as much as possible by maintaining blood sugar and not letting cortisol spike at all. when cortisol spikes ,your body will release fat including PGD2 that has been accumulating, granted if you have been eating unhealthy during most of your life, whih i will assume most people with MPB have.

if you are eating raw vegan, you probably aren't getting PUFA either, another win for hair loss. but really ,what is causing the hair loss, that is the question.

so i mean, as long as your cortisol isn't spiknig too high, i think it could be good. i just don't see how somoene with a bad thyroid, aka the lady i work with, based on her temperature being so low, can maintain hair. hair = thyroid.

then again, i'm coming from the assumption that PGD2 causes hair loss and low thyroid would assume you have higher cortiol there. i mean, if you have no PGD2 in your fat cells, maybe it is not a problem.

jared leto, he also looks really young, he's like 44 or 45 and looks like he's in his 20's, even early 30's, but still good. he has been thi way for a long time, i dont think he has many PUFA in his body, maybe that is how he avoided balding?

oysters do contain toxins, i agree, i think they contain many metals accumulated there, however, and a big however, they contain many trace minerals that you wouldn't get from other places, which is why ray recommends it, but recommends it on a weekly basis or a couple times a week, not everyday for that reason. probably if your liver is in good shape, you could probably handle it.

another part of the problem with balding is the fungus and dandruff part of it. it really seems like a lot of people balding have the dandruff. i have it too, even right now, i've been working close to 12 months trying to fight it and not really getting anywhere in that time. i don't know where that plays a part, how is it releated to PGD2, and is it PGD2 that is a part of the dandruff aspect? if you lose your hair from PGd2, is it different from losing it from fungus?

it seems to me some kind of histamine reaction to things, maybe from a lack of properly workin thyroid, causing sinus buildup in the skull or something along those lines leading to all the problems. i really dk though. really the reason i follow peat is because he connects the hormones back to the diet and back again. you know what you are doing from a thyroid perspective with food. aka, you eat fruit, your thyroid turns on, you need protein with it to handle it, and these vitamins do xyz with estrogen, progesterone, thyroid, etc etc.

with raw vegan, i don't really know what is happening how or how to fix it.

anyway that is a lot, a lot of things i've been thinking about lately, and things that are not really well covered anywhere unfortuantely at this time, and probably won't be explained for another couple hundred of years. if you can handle the vegan diet , that is amazing, but i think it takes al ot of work to make it work, and i really dk the cause of baldness, so i don't know if it would really help from that perspective.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Tue Aug 30, 2016 11:00 pm

sanderson wrote:
john3333 wrote:
sanderson wrote:
are you kidding me? eggs, milk, liver, oysters, bone broth has no nutrients? it was way more nutrient dense than any other diet. coconut oil is the healthiest.. it mimics the state of your body... look at it, in the hot weather, it turns to liquid. you think gluten is good for you??? WTF??
Oysters and seafood are too high in toxins.
Gluten grains are good for most people. They have hundreds of antioxidants. CS has talked about one antioxidant found in wheat, lignans. Phytic acid, which is sold as a supplement, is another antioxidant missing from a Peatarian diet that has a wide range of benefits including protection against cancer.  Wheat has anti-cancer properties.
Vegan diets are proven to cure heart disease, while Peatarian diets may cause heart attacks. If someone gets a heart attack on a diet, the diet may not be such a good one.
https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/i-had-a-heart-attack-on-sat-22-8-2015.7621/
It's not surprising since saturated fat clogged the arteries of eskimos.
The people who will beat Jeanne Calment have already been born and they are vegans. One of those vegans might be this young 70 year old vegan. Wait a few years for the older raw vegans to make it to the age of 100+ with a full head of hair. This is what happens when you follow a diet based on scientific evidence, not just hope.
If Jeanne Calment ate coconut oil instead of olive oil she would have died at 80 since coconut oil has no micronutrients.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gZ4U3V5LEc
CS's supplements are extracts that can be found in foods, including plants.
All of my friends who are interested in health eat whole grains and legumes. The other people who eat meat with salads and fruit are overweight. Everyone interested in longevity and who spends loads of their days reading studies tends to eat a diet that lowers IGF1 and low in protein. When you disagree with me, you're disagreeing with the majority of people interested in health. It's common knowledge that processed foods, which include oil and butter, are unhealthy.
Grains are not much different from vegetables. They are both rich in minerals and phytonutrients.
Plant foods contain beta-sitosterol, and so they are hairgrowth-promoting.
Edit: I forgot to say that I went mostly gluten-free for three years since everybody said it was bad. I realized it's actually a superfood and just another normal safe grain and have added it back into my diet. Since adding it back into my diet, I have not experienced any increased hairloss or inflammation.






I'm not saying a vegan diet is perfect. The perfect one would be raw vegan of course. Liquidarian diet is good too especially for beginners.

good points. the fact that someone ages barely anything on the vegan diet is a big draw for me and something i've thought about a lot. it's clear ray peat isn't aging any better than them. from a female perspective, i think the raw vegan diet would work well, but it's interesting the effects of it. i work with a woman who is a vegan, i will not lie, she does look young for her age without a doubt. without a doubt. she looks good. she's in her 40s, maybe even 50s  actually. however, her temperature is very, very low. one time i felt her hand, it felt like ice cold.

it's clear her thyroid wasn't working well on the diet. why? probably not enough carbs. we all care about hair here, so really at the end of the day, who cares as long as it keeps hair right? well that is honestly the dillemma. i don't know the cause of hair loss.

i think the vegan diet probably makes you age better because you are releasing less insulin for one. fruit doesn't spike insulin very high compared to regular sugar. the thing is with fructose versus regular sugar. however, on the peat diet, the big insulin spiker is dairy. but his major carb is also fruit juice, so he has that going for him. however, peat is also utilizing thyroid hormone to handle the insulin load. i think the insulin will still go very high with dairy and thyroid won't be able to really stop it though, it still will spike high no matter what.

really, i don't understand hair loss, i don't think anyone does.

it seems like a big problem is PGD2 as being high in scalps with balding. for sake of argument, let's say that this is the cause of hair loss. this is essentially PUFA causing this. PUFA is the precursor to it being created. PUFA accumulates in your fat cells when you eat those bad oils. i mean, basically ray peat diet is making you lower cortisol as much as possible by maintaining blood sugar and not letting cortisol spike at all. when cortisol spikes ,your body will release fat including PGD2 that has been accumulating, granted if you have been eating unhealthy during most of your life, whih i will assume most people with MPB have.

if you are eating raw vegan, you probably aren't getting PUFA either, another win for hair loss. but really ,what is causing the hair loss, that is the question.

so i mean, as long as your cortisol isn't spiknig too high, i think it could be good. i just don't see how somoene with a bad thyroid, aka the lady i work with, based on her temperature being so low, can maintain hair. hair = thyroid.

then again, i'm coming from the assumption that PGD2 causes hair loss and low thyroid would assume you have higher cortiol there. i mean, if you have no PGD2 in your fat cells, maybe it is not a problem.

jared leto, he also looks really young, he's like 44 or 45 and looks like he's in his 20's, even early 30's, but still good. he has been thi way for a long time, i dont think he has many PUFA in his body, maybe that is how he avoided balding?

oysters do contain toxins, i agree, i think they contain many metals accumulated there, however, and a big however, they contain many trace minerals that you wouldn't get from other places, which is why ray recommends it, but recommends it on a weekly basis or a couple times a week, not everyday for that reason. probably if your liver is in good shape, you could probably handle it.

another part of the problem with balding is the fungus and dandruff part of it. it really seems like a lot of people balding have the dandruff. i have it too, even right now, i've been working close to 12 months trying to fight it and not really getting anywhere in that time. i don't know where that plays a part, how is it releated to PGD2, and is it PGD2 that is a part of the dandruff aspect? if you lose your hair from PGd2, is it different from losing it from fungus?

it seems to me some kind of histamine reaction to things, maybe from a lack of properly workin thyroid, causing sinus buildup in the skull or something along those lines leading to all the problems. i really dk though. really the reason i follow peat is because he connects the hormones back to the diet and back again. you know what you are doing from a thyroid perspective with food. aka, you eat fruit, your thyroid turns on, you need protein with it to handle it, and these vitamins do xyz with estrogen, progesterone, thyroid, etc etc.

with raw vegan, i don't really know what is happening how or how to fix it.

anyway that is a lot, a lot of things i've been thinking about lately, and things that are not really well covered anywhere unfortuantely at this time, and probably won't be explained for another couple hundred of years. if you can handle the vegan diet , that is amazing, but i think it takes al ot of work to make it work, and i really dk the cause of baldness, so i don't know if it would really help from that perspective.
If you don't want to go vegan, the least you should do is avoid salt. Salt is worshipped by Ray Peat and PerfectHealthDiet.
Salt is dangerous. When I eat it, I get thirsty. This is not natural. Even fruitarians, who get tons of water,potassium and other electrolytes, experience raises in blood pressure and severe thirst after the 1/4th tsp of salt. You're putting yourself at risk for heart disease when you eat it. Michael Greger's research and the testimonials of thousands prove that salt is anti-health.

Do this and you will not have problems with hypertension. Oils also cause hypertension. Oils might be WORSE than liver. Don't be afraid of mineral-rich fruits like bananas and mangos.
Peatarians crave salt because they are deficient in potassium,calcium, and magnesium- all of which are found in mineral-rich fruits or grains.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  blackjack on Wed Aug 31, 2016 12:46 am

I'm on a peat diet and i get plenty of potassium, magnesium, calcium...

I could see a vegan diet being a good diet for some people. I have been down that road once before I guess I could always reattempt it.


Can you post what you eat in a day, and how much protein you get?

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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Wed Aug 31, 2016 9:32 am

blackjack wrote:I'm on a peat diet and i get plenty of potassium, magnesium, calcium...

I could see a vegan diet being a good diet for some people. I have been down that road once before I guess I could always reattempt it.


Can you post what you eat in a day, and how much protein you get?
http://rawtill4diet.com/raw-till-4-diet-plan/
Protein may cause apoptosis of the hair follicle cells, so I try to avoid it.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  blackjack on Wed Aug 31, 2016 10:05 am

Seems like a good diet but i would need to include some liver / meat and get about 3-4x more protein and i think i could rock it.

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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Wed Aug 31, 2016 10:19 am

blackjack,
Protein is an obesogen and carcinogen at high doses. This is why zero fruitarians are fat or have cancer. It's impossible to get cancer as a fruitarian.
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ez5pP2PSkgg/hqdefault.jpg
This is what durianrider looks like thanks to his diet of fruit, sugar, and rice.
Protein causes aging.
Protein restriction makes people live longer.
Calorie restriction makes people live longer because you eat less protein.
Protein is just one of the many unhealthy components of meat.
Protein increases the cancer growth-promoting hormone, IGF-1.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  blackjack on Wed Aug 31, 2016 10:27 am

durianrider takes steroids though...


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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Wed Aug 31, 2016 10:30 am

blackjack wrote:durianrider takes steroids though...

http://static4.techinsider.io/image/56bc9dd82e526554008b67f6-1920-1080/vegan%20gains%20youtube%20announcement.png
Vegan Gains can't stop gaining muscle mass on a vegan diet.
He also has a good hairline thanks to veganism.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  blackjack on Wed Aug 31, 2016 10:33 am


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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Wed Aug 31, 2016 10:48 am

blackjack wrote:have you seen this guy?
https://www.youtube.com/user/JRawRose/videos
There's lots of people who are ripped on a vegan diet. It's the best way to eat for hairgrowth.

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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  blackjack on Wed Aug 31, 2016 10:51 am

Does raw vs cooked make any difference?

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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Wed Aug 31, 2016 12:01 pm

blackjack wrote:Does raw vs cooked make any difference?
Fruits are lower in protein than some starches, so they're better.
Cooking grains creates acrylamide. Grains and vegetables are still the safest food to cook though. Cooking meat and oil creates thousands of other worse substances.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_glycation_end-product
I wouldn't worry about the tiny amounts of acrylamide in steamed potatoes though. Durianrider eats tons of potatoes. The problem is when you fry them in coconut oil. Oil is very bad for other reasons too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acrolein
If you want to learn more about the dangers of eating fat, read studies about the ketogenic diet.
Fat and protein are the most heat sensitive macronutrients. This is why you don't see people cooking their avocados ever. Carbohydrates are safe cooked and even better raw.
As long as you avoid liver,coconut oil, and salt you're going to be healthy.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  sanderson on Wed Aug 31, 2016 12:30 pm

john3333 wrote:
sanderson wrote:
john3333 wrote:
sanderson wrote:
are you kidding me? eggs, milk, liver, oysters, bone broth has no nutrients? it was way more nutrient dense than any other diet. coconut oil is the healthiest.. it mimics the state of your body... look at it, in the hot weather, it turns to liquid. you think gluten is good for you??? WTF??
Oysters and seafood are too high in toxins.
Gluten grains are good for most people. They have hundreds of antioxidants. CS has talked about one antioxidant found in wheat, lignans. Phytic acid, which is sold as a supplement, is another antioxidant missing from a Peatarian diet that has a wide range of benefits including protection against cancer.  Wheat has anti-cancer properties.
Vegan diets are proven to cure heart disease, while Peatarian diets may cause heart attacks. If someone gets a heart attack on a diet, the diet may not be such a good one.
https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/i-had-a-heart-attack-on-sat-22-8-2015.7621/
It's not surprising since saturated fat clogged the arteries of eskimos.
The people who will beat Jeanne Calment have already been born and they are vegans. One of those vegans might be this young 70 year old vegan. Wait a few years for the older raw vegans to make it to the age of 100+ with a full head of hair. This is what happens when you follow a diet based on scientific evidence, not just hope.
If Jeanne Calment ate coconut oil instead of olive oil she would have died at 80 since coconut oil has no micronutrients.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gZ4U3V5LEc
CS's supplements are extracts that can be found in foods, including plants.
All of my friends who are interested in health eat whole grains and legumes. The other people who eat meat with salads and fruit are overweight. Everyone interested in longevity and who spends loads of their days reading studies tends to eat a diet that lowers IGF1 and low in protein. When you disagree with me, you're disagreeing with the majority of people interested in health. It's common knowledge that processed foods, which include oil and butter, are unhealthy.
Grains are not much different from vegetables. They are both rich in minerals and phytonutrients.
Plant foods contain beta-sitosterol, and so they are hairgrowth-promoting.
Edit: I forgot to say that I went mostly gluten-free for three years since everybody said it was bad. I realized it's actually a superfood and just another normal safe grain and have added it back into my diet. Since adding it back into my diet, I have not experienced any increased hairloss or inflammation.






I'm not saying a vegan diet is perfect. The perfect one would be raw vegan of course. Liquidarian diet is good too especially for beginners.

good points. the fact that someone ages barely anything on the vegan diet is a big draw for me and something i've thought about a lot. it's clear ray peat isn't aging any better than them. from a female perspective, i think the raw vegan diet would work well, but it's interesting the effects of it. i work with a woman who is a vegan, i will not lie, she does look young for her age without a doubt. without a doubt. she looks good. she's in her 40s, maybe even 50s  actually. however, her temperature is very, very low. one time i felt her hand, it felt like ice cold.

it's clear her thyroid wasn't working well on the diet. why? probably not enough carbs. we all care about hair here, so really at the end of the day, who cares as long as it keeps hair right? well that is honestly the dillemma. i don't know the cause of hair loss.

i think the vegan diet probably makes you age better because you are releasing less insulin for one. fruit doesn't spike insulin very high compared to regular sugar. the thing is with fructose versus regular sugar. however, on the peat diet, the big insulin spiker is dairy. but his major carb is also fruit juice, so he has that going for him. however, peat is also utilizing thyroid hormone to handle the insulin load. i think the insulin will still go very high with dairy and thyroid won't be able to really stop it though, it still will spike high no matter what.

really, i don't understand hair loss, i don't think anyone does.

it seems like a big problem is PGD2 as being high in scalps with balding. for sake of argument, let's say that this is the cause of hair loss. this is essentially PUFA causing this. PUFA is the precursor to it being created. PUFA accumulates in your fat cells when you eat those bad oils. i mean, basically ray peat diet is making you lower cortisol as much as possible by maintaining blood sugar and not letting cortisol spike at all. when cortisol spikes ,your body will release fat including PGD2 that has been accumulating, granted if you have been eating unhealthy during most of your life, whih i will assume most people with MPB have.

if you are eating raw vegan, you probably aren't getting PUFA either, another win for hair loss. but really ,what is causing the hair loss, that is the question.

so i mean, as long as your cortisol isn't spiknig too high, i think it could be good. i just don't see how somoene with a bad thyroid, aka the lady i work with, based on her temperature being so low, can maintain hair. hair = thyroid.

then again, i'm coming from the assumption that PGD2 causes hair loss and low thyroid would assume you have higher cortiol there. i mean, if you have no PGD2 in your fat cells, maybe it is not a problem.

jared leto, he also looks really young, he's like 44 or 45 and looks like he's in his 20's, even early 30's, but still good. he has been thi way for a long time, i dont think he has many PUFA in his body, maybe that is how he avoided balding?

oysters do contain toxins, i agree, i think they contain many metals accumulated there, however, and a big however, they contain many trace minerals that you wouldn't get from other places, which is why ray recommends it, but recommends it on a weekly basis or a couple times a week, not everyday for that reason. probably if your liver is in good shape, you could probably handle it.

another part of the problem with balding is the fungus and dandruff part of it. it really seems like a lot of people balding have the dandruff. i have it too, even right now, i've been working close to 12 months trying to fight it and not really getting anywhere in that time. i don't know where that plays a part, how is it releated to PGD2, and is it PGD2 that is a part of the dandruff aspect? if you lose your hair from PGd2, is it different from losing it from fungus?

it seems to me some kind of histamine reaction to things, maybe from a lack of properly workin thyroid, causing sinus buildup in the skull or something along those lines leading to all the problems. i really dk though. really the reason i follow peat is because he connects the hormones back to the diet and back again. you know what you are doing from a thyroid perspective with food. aka, you eat fruit, your thyroid turns on, you need protein with it to handle it, and these vitamins do xyz with estrogen, progesterone, thyroid, etc etc.

with raw vegan, i don't really know what is happening how or how to fix it.

anyway that is a lot, a lot of things i've been thinking about lately, and things that are not really well covered anywhere unfortuantely at this time, and probably won't be explained for another couple hundred of years. if you can handle the vegan diet , that is amazing, but i think it takes al ot of work to make it work, and i really dk the cause of baldness, so i don't know if it would really help from that perspective.
If you don't want to go vegan, the least you should do is avoid salt. Salt is worshipped by Ray Peat and PerfectHealthDiet.
Salt is dangerous. When I eat it, I get thirsty. This is not natural. Even fruitarians, who get tons of water,potassium and other electrolytes, experience raises in blood pressure and severe thirst after the 1/4th tsp of salt. You're putting yourself at risk for heart disease when you eat it. Michael Greger's research and the testimonials of thousands prove that salt is anti-health.

Do this and you will not have problems with hypertension. Oils also cause hypertension. Oils might be WORSE than liver. Don't be afraid of mineral-rich fruits like bananas and mangos.
Peatarians crave salt because they are deficient in potassium,calcium, and magnesium- all of which are found in mineral-rich fruits or grains.

That's not true... salt allows your body to retain magnesium, calcium, and potassium, it is not bad for you, it is amazing for you. Salt also increases your metabolic rate. That's why it is making you want to eat more. Without adequate salt in your diet, you are going to be losing those essential minerals.

And his diet is very high in potassium, calcium, and magnesium. If you read his prolactin article, he actually praises magnesium and calcium in a very, very high way. Calcium and magnesium both help to suppress prolactin. Ray peat himself gets like 4k mg of calcium a day. Yes, 4,000mg a day. I said that right. He also advocates dairy as the main source of protein in the diet. That is the biggest calcium source. And he drinks like 5 cups a day of coffee, which i where he gets the magnesium. He also recommends epsom salt baths, gelatin, and kale broth as other ways to get magnesium.

If anything.. the vegan diet is lacking in calcium massively and probably will make you increase your prolactin. You realize how much kale you need to eat to get calcium? Like an entire plate full, literally a full plate stacked up in order to get the daily requirement and it's only in the dark leafy greens. I think you should take another look at it.. those facts are not true. I have tried eating enough kale to get the daily calcium requirement.. I will tell you right now, good luck with that. It is basically not possible. You will want to throw up from eating enough of it.
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Re: Official Vegan Thread

Post  john3333 on Wed Aug 31, 2016 1:18 pm

sanderson wrote:
john3333 wrote:
sanderson wrote:
john3333 wrote:
sanderson wrote:
are you kidding me? eggs, milk, liver, oysters, bone broth has no nutrients? it was way more nutrient dense than any other diet. coconut oil is the healthiest.. it mimics the state of your body... look at it, in the hot weather, it turns to liquid. you think gluten is good for you??? WTF??
Oysters and seafood are too high in toxins.
Gluten grains are good for most people. They have hundreds of antioxidants. CS has talked about one antioxidant found in wheat, lignans. Phytic acid, which is sold as a supplement, is another antioxidant missing from a Peatarian diet that has a wide range of benefits including protection against cancer.  Wheat has anti-cancer properties.
Vegan diets are proven to cure heart disease, while Peatarian diets may cause heart attacks. If someone gets a heart attack on a diet, the diet may not be such a good one.
https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/i-had-a-heart-attack-on-sat-22-8-2015.7621/
It's not surprising since saturated fat clogged the arteries of eskimos.
The people who will beat Jeanne Calment have already been born and they are vegans. One of those vegans might be this young 70 year old vegan. Wait a few years for the older raw vegans to make it to the age of 100+ with a full head of hair. This is what happens when you follow a diet based on scientific evidence, not just hope.
If Jeanne Calment ate coconut oil instead of olive oil she would have died at 80 since coconut oil has no micronutrients.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gZ4U3V5LEc
CS's supplements are extracts that can be found in foods, including plants.
All of my friends who are interested in health eat whole grains and legumes. The other people who eat meat with salads and fruit are overweight. Everyone interested in longevity and who spends loads of their days reading studies tends to eat a diet that lowers IGF1 and low in protein. When you disagree with me, you're disagreeing with the majority of people interested in health. It's common knowledge that processed foods, which include oil and butter, are unhealthy.
Grains are not much different from vegetables. They are both rich in minerals and phytonutrients.
Plant foods contain beta-sitosterol, and so they are hairgrowth-promoting.
Edit: I forgot to say that I went mostly gluten-free for three years since everybody said it was bad. I realized it's actually a superfood and just another normal safe grain and have added it back into my diet. Since adding it back into my diet, I have not experienced any increased hairloss or inflammation.






I'm not saying a vegan diet is perfect. The perfect one would be raw vegan of course. Liquidarian diet is good too especially for beginners.

good points. the fact that someone ages barely anything on the vegan diet is a big draw for me and something i've thought about a lot. it's clear ray peat isn't aging any better than them. from a female perspective, i think the raw vegan diet would work well, but it's interesting the effects of it. i work with a woman who is a vegan, i will not lie, she does look young for her age without a doubt. without a doubt. she looks good. she's in her 40s, maybe even 50s  actually. however, her temperature is very, very low. one time i felt her hand, it felt like ice cold.

it's clear her thyroid wasn't working well on the diet. why? probably not enough carbs. we all care about hair here, so really at the end of the day, who cares as long as it keeps hair right? well that is honestly the dillemma. i don't know the cause of hair loss.

i think the vegan diet probably makes you age better because you are releasing less insulin for one. fruit doesn't spike insulin very high compared to regular sugar. the thing is with fructose versus regular sugar. however, on the peat diet, the big insulin spiker is dairy. but his major carb is also fruit juice, so he has that going for him. however, peat is also utilizing thyroid hormone to handle the insulin load. i think the insulin will still go very high with dairy and thyroid won't be able to really stop it though, it still will spike high no matter what.

really, i don't understand hair loss, i don't think anyone does.

it seems like a big problem is PGD2 as being high in scalps with balding. for sake of argument, let's say that this is the cause of hair loss. this is essentially PUFA causing this. PUFA is the precursor to it being created. PUFA accumulates in your fat cells when you eat those bad oils. i mean, basically ray peat diet is making you lower cortisol as much as possible by maintaining blood sugar and not letting cortisol spike at all. when cortisol spikes ,your body will release fat including PGD2 that has been accumulating, granted if you have been eating unhealthy during most of your life, whih i will assume most people with MPB have.

if you are eating raw vegan, you probably aren't getting PUFA either, another win for hair loss. but really ,what is causing the hair loss, that is the question.

so i mean, as long as your cortisol isn't spiknig too high, i think it could be good. i just don't see how somoene with a bad thyroid, aka the lady i work with, based on her temperature being so low, can maintain hair. hair = thyroid.

then again, i'm coming from the assumption that PGD2 causes hair loss and low thyroid would assume you have higher cortiol there. i mean, if you have no PGD2 in your fat cells, maybe it is not a problem.

jared leto, he also looks really young, he's like 44 or 45 and looks like he's in his 20's, even early 30's, but still good. he has been thi way for a long time, i dont think he has many PUFA in his body, maybe that is how he avoided balding?

oysters do contain toxins, i agree, i think they contain many metals accumulated there, however, and a big however, they contain many trace minerals that you wouldn't get from other places, which is why ray recommends it, but recommends it on a weekly basis or a couple times a week, not everyday for that reason. probably if your liver is in good shape, you could probably handle it.

another part of the problem with balding is the fungus and dandruff part of it. it really seems like a lot of people balding have the dandruff. i have it too, even right now, i've been working close to 12 months trying to fight it and not really getting anywhere in that time. i don't know where that plays a part, how is it releated to PGD2, and is it PGD2 that is a part of the dandruff aspect? if you lose your hair from PGd2, is it different from losing it from fungus?

it seems to me some kind of histamine reaction to things, maybe from a lack of properly workin thyroid, causing sinus buildup in the skull or something along those lines leading to all the problems. i really dk though. really the reason i follow peat is because he connects the hormones back to the diet and back again. you know what you are doing from a thyroid perspective with food. aka, you eat fruit, your thyroid turns on, you need protein with it to handle it, and these vitamins do xyz with estrogen, progesterone, thyroid, etc etc.

with raw vegan, i don't really know what is happening how or how to fix it.

anyway that is a lot, a lot of things i've been thinking about lately, and things that are not really well covered anywhere unfortuantely at this time, and probably won't be explained for another couple hundred of years. if you can handle the vegan diet , that is amazing, but i think it takes al ot of work to make it work, and i really dk the cause of baldness, so i don't know if it would really help from that perspective.
If you don't want to go vegan, the least you should do is avoid salt. Salt is worshipped by Ray Peat and PerfectHealthDiet.
Salt is dangerous. When I eat it, I get thirsty. This is not natural. Even fruitarians, who get tons of water,potassium and other electrolytes, experience raises in blood pressure and severe thirst after the 1/4th tsp of salt. You're putting yourself at risk for heart disease when you eat it. Michael Greger's research and the testimonials of thousands prove that salt is anti-health.

Do this and you will not have problems with hypertension. Oils also cause hypertension. Oils might be WORSE than liver. Don't be afraid of mineral-rich fruits like bananas and mangos.
Peatarians crave salt because they are deficient in potassium,calcium, and magnesium- all of which are found in mineral-rich fruits or grains.

That's not true... salt allows your body to retain magnesium, calcium, and potassium, it is not bad for you, it is amazing for you. Salt also increases your metabolic rate. That's why it is making you want to eat more. Without adequate salt in your diet, you are going to be losing those essential minerals.

And his diet is very high in potassium, calcium, and magnesium. If you read his prolactin article, he actually praises magnesium and calcium in a very, very high way. Calcium and magnesium both help to suppress prolactin. Ray peat himself gets like 4k mg of calcium a day. Yes, 4,000mg a day. I said that right. He also advocates dairy as the main source of protein in the diet. That is the biggest calcium source. And he drinks like 5 cups a day of coffee, which i where he gets the magnesium. He also recommends epsom salt baths, gelatin, and kale broth as other ways to get magnesium.

If anything.. the vegan diet is lacking in calcium massively and probably will make you increase your prolactin. You realize how much kale you need to eat to get calcium? Like an entire plate full, literally a full plate stacked up in order to get the daily requirement and it's only in the dark leafy greens. I think you should take another look at it.. those facts are not true. I have tried eating enough kale to get the daily calcium requirement.. I will tell you right now, good luck with that. It is basically not possible. You will want to throw up from eating enough of it.
Almond milk has more calcium than cow's milk.

Raw milk can have parasites and bacteria.
Milk is high in antibiotics and pesticides. It also raises IGF-1 too much.
Too much calcium might lead to calcification.
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