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Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

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Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  H4ir on Fri Sep 02, 2011 10:56 pm

I was looking for information on herbs to block 5 alpha reductase but came across something I really cant believe.

In two studies I read Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin) showed a very high 5AR inhibition rate. In one study the potency was IC50 =1.6 M and in another the potency was IC50 = 15 +/- 13 M.

Finastride had a potency of IC50 = 0.06 M

If then the potency of vit B2 has been observed to be between IC50 = 1.6 15 M it would mean that at best Fin is 250 times more potent (15/0.06).

This would mean that at most we would need 250 times higher dose of vit B2 to equal the same 5ar inhibiting value of fin.

Well Propecia comes in 1mg tablets so if it is 250 times stronger then vit B2 you would need 250mg of vit B2 to equal it theoretically.

You can easily purchase 500mg vit B2 capsules which should be twice the dose needed.

I also read that vit B2 is easily and rapidly absorbed by the body and because it is water soluble any excess is passed out in the urine (will make your urine bright yellow)

To add to this Vit B2 is an Aromatase inhibitor. When men get older they produce less testosterone and more estragon. Estragon however is not good for the male body and vit B2 will block its production.

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  Lambaugh on Fri Sep 02, 2011 11:05 pm

The potential side effects would be the same.

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  H4ir on Fri Sep 02, 2011 11:09 pm

Lambaugh wrote:The potential side effects would be the same.

Maby not, the body needs vit B2 but not fin so the body processes vit B2 everyday of your life!

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  pancacke on Fri Sep 02, 2011 11:55 pm

Seems like I'm the only one using this in therapeutic doses:
http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t6224-laser-helmet-shedding#60494

300-400mg per meal 3x daily(=~1g per day)

First I have been on since nearly 6 months and my hair grows like weed. No single supplement from IH6 did so much for my hair(and I tried all, except the new updated ones).....



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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  pancacke on Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:06 am

Wikipedia on riboflavin:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riboflavin
"During the deficiency state, dermatitis develops together with hair loss."

Intresting that thallium robs the body of B2 and thallium and hairloss go hand in hand.........even though noboedy here treats thallium.......
That's why I use potassium aspartate together with B2 -potassium binds the thallium and B" can be used by the body.......

http://onibasu.com/archives/am/130725.html
Thallium is concentrated into certain cells because it binds to a
specific site on a cell surface mineral transport protein that is
normally used to take potassium up in exchange for sodium (the
biochemical term is Na,K ATPase). It concentrates particularly well
into the brain, kidney, and the part of the heart called the
myocardium. In addition to binding to the sulfhydryl groups of various
enzymes, thallium specifically attaches to vitamin B2 ? riboflavin ?
and inactivates it. Without vitamin B2 fats can't be burned for energy
and the main route that carbohydrates take into the energy producing
Krebs cycle through pyruvate is also blocked.

edit: note that Thallium goes to the brain and heart.......same places where aspartate goes too.....

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  H4ir on Sat Sep 03, 2011 1:15 am

400mg x 3 = 1200mg per day of vit B2, I think thats probably way more the you need, your urine must glow in the dark lol

I am going to try 500-600mg per day taken with fulvic acid to insure absorbtion.

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  pancacke on Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:29 am

No I do 300-400mg per meal and i get 1g average per day.....the urine is glowing but the B2 isn't wasted, trust me(I know the differnce between 600 and 900mg)......

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  pancacke on Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:32 am

H4ir wrote:I am going to try 500-600mg per day taken with fulvic acid to insure absorbtion.
Go for it and let me know how you like it!

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  randle20 on Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:25 pm

Interesting information.

I usually take 2 of these daily with my iodine and they include 100mg of riboflavin.

http://www.vrp.com/energizers/atp-cofactors
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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  mphatesmpb on Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:50 pm

Did the source distinguish between the two isoforms of 5AR? Finasteride selectively inhibits type-II 5AR, which I believe occurs mostly around the sex organs. It only slightly inhibits the activity of the type-I isoform, which occurs mostly in the skin.

Vitamin B6 has been shown to reduce by 40% the protein synthesis that occurs in dermal papilla cells after DHT binds to the androgen receptor.

A while ago I posted a study about how synthetic forms of B vitamins have a shorter half-life than their natural counterparts:
http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t4748-cs-multivitamin-dessicated-liver-brewer-s-yeast?highlight=dessicated

It increasingly seems like simple vitamin deficiency might be one of the major causes of our deteriorating health. I've now read studies showing that standard modern diets are deficient in pretty much every vitamin...C, D, E, K, A, and now B. Add to that deficiencies in trace minerals.
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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  sc871 on Sat Sep 03, 2011 4:07 pm

I thought Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin) in high amounts or extended use is hard on the kidneys... Are you using a natural or synthetic form?

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  H4ir on Sat Sep 03, 2011 10:08 pm

mphatesmpb wrote:Did the source distinguish between the two isoforms of 5AR? Finasteride selectively inhibits type-II 5AR, which I believe occurs mostly around the sex organs. It only slightly inhibits the activity of the type-I isoform, which occurs mostly in the skin.

Yes in both studies it confirmed that vit b2 blocks type II 5AR

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  H4ir on Sat Sep 03, 2011 10:14 pm

sc871 wrote:I thought Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin) in high amounts or extended use is hard on the kidneys... Are you using a natural or synthetic form?

No the research I have done confirms that there is no reported toxicity observed from taking vit b2. One study involved a group taking 400mg per day for 6 months and there was no reported side effects observed. If you suffer from migraine taking 400mg per day is said to greatly help.

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  rofl on Sun Sep 04, 2011 3:00 am

If then the potency of vit B2 has been observed to be between IC50 = 1.6 15 M it would mean that at best Fin is 250 times more potent (15/0.06).

This would mean that at most we would need 250 times higher dose of vit B2 to equal the same 5ar inhibiting value of fin.

No it doesnt mean that.

just because u increase the dose of something 250 times, doesnt mean u will get 250 times the efficacy. Especially in the case of inhibiting 5ar reductase, we all know its a 'all or none' reaction.


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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  tonyj on Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:39 am

Is there an established toxicity level for B2? I don't see one for Biotin either. Is it possible that established daily intake is far less than what we need to be taking?
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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  crincrin on Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:52 am

Interesting post. Wikipedia says no sides at 400mg/day for 3 months.
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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  mphatesmpb on Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:39 am


No it doesnt mean that.

just because u increase the dose of something 250 times, doesnt mean u will get 250 times the efficacy. Especially in the case of inhibiting 5ar reductase, we all know its a 'all or none' reaction.

I agree with Anxious. I don't think it's that simple.


No the research I have done confirms that there is no reported toxicity observed from taking vit b2. One study involved a group taking 400mg per day for 6 months and there was no reported side effects observed. If you suffer from migraine taking 400mg per day is said to greatly help.

Generally with water-soluble vitamins (B and C), the risk for toxicity is negligible, since they are rapidly excreted when you have take too much. But I read somewhere that problems can result if the B complex is out of balance, so supplementation with just one member of the group might be an issue.

I also imagine that when you take a massive dose of one particular type, the body will increase excretion of that particular type in order to restore balance.

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  H4ir on Mon Sep 05, 2011 8:38 pm

IC5O simply means the amount of substance either in weight or volume to reduce the activity of another substance by 50%. A higher IC number means exactly that i.e. it takes a higher concentration of that substance to achieve the "same goal" (reduction in activity by 50%)
It is possible that the human body will not allow absorption significantly over the amount of b2 required however no point arguing on this point, we really dont know the answer. You have to try it and see if you get any observable results.
Note that no sides have been observed from taking high concentration of vit b2, that includes no sexual sides unlike fin

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  pancacke on Mon Sep 05, 2011 11:20 pm

More notes on Thallium:

-goes to brain, heart(myocardium), kidney, nervous system
-binds to riboflavin(and deactivates it); potassium receptorss(Na,K ATPase); sulfhydryl groups of various enzymes;
-reabsorbed in the kidneys(potassium receptors);
-half life in the body 8-30 days(but stays in the nervous system)
-excreted mainly with intestinal (digestion)fluids; less with bile and urine
-sources are pesticides, rat poison, jewelry, ringworm remedies and depilatory creams, fireworks
-Vanadium and thallium are syergistic toxins
-activated charcoal to prevent reabsorbtion in the intestines
-DMSA to reduce body levels
-ALA
-high potassium intake to increase rate of clearance(<1/2 tsp. potassium chloride per day; spreaded and with meals)
-biotin, b2 and magnesium(aspartate, malate), heart support(carnitine,hawthrone extract,coenzyme Q-10)




-high intake of potassium aspartate
-rasing potassium levels indirectly
-use adrenal miracle mix
-cilantro for mobilizing in the nervous system(works?) and intracellular(works?)
-chlorella to to dump bile
-vanadium detox
-R-la for thallium bound to other metals(and brain mobilizing?)

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  Mawson06 on Wed Sep 07, 2011 7:59 pm

I was wondering what's the difference between Procyanidin b2 and Riboflavin b2?

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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  mphatesmpb on Thu Sep 08, 2011 2:33 am

Riboflavin is a B-vitamin, and procyanidins are flavanols found in foods like apples and cocoa.
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Re: Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin)

Post  Mxssingno on Sat Nov 03, 2018 8:24 pm

I deleted my old post because I'm concerned about the risk of floaters from excessive riboflavin when eyes are exposed to UV light. However I found an interesting study, so I'm rebumping this thread...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6748643

Mechanism of 4-ene-steroid 5 alpha-reductase proton transfer in androgen target tissues
Together these findings demonstrate that FMN and FAD do not directly interfere with Gene-steroid Sa-reductase activity, but reconstitute an alternative process that converts NADPH to NADP+, a compound known to inhibit 4-ene-steroid Sa-reductase in a non-competitive manner[4]

[4] https://www.researchgate.net/publication/16327851_Solubilization_and_partial_characterization_of_rat_epididymal_D_4_-steroid_5_a-reductase_cholestenone_5_a-reductase

In that study FMN 50umol/l reduced 5aR to 45%, and 0% at 250umol/l. 250umol/l Riboflavin-5-Phosphate = 0.11958 mg/mL.

Is this just a side effect of studying 5aR in-vitro, or would this be achievable in live tissue? Can anyone think of a good reason I shouldn't rub R5P into my scalp, other than the fact that my head will smell slightly of piss? Yes I realise I am just talking to myself here Neutral

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