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Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  Orchid on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:32 am

I tried EC for 4 months and didn't notice any improvement anywhere. Maybe my dosage wasn't high enough, or something. I found it to be far too expensive for my budget to consider continuing or further upping the dosage.
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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  moby on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:53 am

I don't understand the logic with people who suggest using this as a topical. Are you seriously suggesting using it as a topical for the rest of your life? Most of that won't absorb systematically so that's just wasted money

>> I tried EC for 4 months and didn't notice any improvement anywhere. Maybe my dosage wasn't high enough, or something. I found it to be >> far too expensive for my budget to consider continuing or further upping the dosage.

Which brand and how much of it were you using? I can't believe that it does absolutely nothing. Those charts show that it inhibits almost as much 5AR as Propecia. You should be getting spectacular results.

Even if EC does nothing else but inhibit 5AR, that should still be enough to halt hair loss forever even though DHT blocking is not what this forum is about but in theory it should work.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  ppm on Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:09 am

moby wrote:All I know is that at SOME DOSAGE point, both Propecia and EC block the same amount of 5AR. What is that point? Does anyone know? Please tell me
You could start at (body weight * 0.07 * 100) mg EC
The 0.07 factor gives your blood volume; and the 100 comes from your first graph (100 μg/mL EC)

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  Orchid on Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:21 am

moby wrote:I don't understand the logic with people who suggest using this as a topical. Are you seriously suggesting using it as a topical for the rest of your life? Most of that won't absorb systematically so that's just wasted money

>> I tried EC for 4 months and didn't notice any improvement anywhere. Maybe my dosage wasn't high enough, or something. I found it to be >> far too expensive for my budget to consider continuing or further upping the dosage.

Which brand and how much of it were you using? I can't believe that it does absolutely nothing. Those charts show that it inhibits almost as much 5AR as Propecia. You should be getting spectacular results.

Even if EC does nothing else but inhibit 5AR, that should still be enough to halt hair loss forever even though DHT blocking is not what this forum is about but in theory it should work.
ortho and I took 2 a day. note, i don't really have any noticeable hair loss problem, i was taking it for general health purposes.
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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  qzack97 on Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:53 am

Even if you upped your dosage, what sort of improvements were you expecting if you didn't have any noticeable hairloss to begin with? Hair comin out of your ears? cat

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  moby on Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:59 am

>> You could start at (body weight * 0.07 * 100) mg EC
>> The 0.07 factor gives your blood volume; and the 100 comes from your first graph (100 μg/mL EC)[/quote]

In my case it comes out to - 1568 mg. I would also assume that that's 1568 mg of PURE Ecklonia Cava. No fillers. Fibroboost that's on IHerb is sold at 1200mg per pill but the real amount of EC is much lower.

EC should be enough to stop hair loss assuming you're free of heavy metals

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  Orchid on Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:32 am

qzack97 wrote:Even if you upped your dosage, what sort of improvements were you expecting if you didn't have any noticeable hairloss to begin with? Hair comin out of your ears? cat
haha, nah, just improvements in other aspects such as stronger erections, improved libido, etc
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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  AS54 on Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:47 am

Moby,

I just want to know what you are thinking with regard to EC internally. You mentioned earlier that you think its ludicrous to use EC as a topical for the rest of our lives. Are you suggesting that you could stop EC internally at some point and the effects (I'm making the grand presumption that it does regrow hair) will be permanent? What basis do you have to think this? I say this only because it defies almost everything we know about biology.
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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  Serge on Sun Nov 18, 2012 11:18 am

HairEvo sells a 98% pure Ecklonia Cava at 160mg per capsule ($30). Much much more EC than Fibroboost.

http://hairevo.com/shop/view-all-products/22-pure-ecklonia-cava-1-bottle.html

I personally don't mind topicals, especially if there is a chance that hair grows back. Would there be any negatives to pouring a capsule or two of 98% pure EC into my Rejuvaplex bottle?

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  moby on Sun Nov 18, 2012 12:23 pm

I can't believe you people can't connect the dots.

Propecia(1 mg daily) blocks X amount of DHT = no hair loss
Ecklonia Cava(in some quantity) blocks the same amount of DHT = ???

Yes, assuming everything else is completely optimized, you could possibly drop EC and your hair won't fall out. But it will take years before everything is optimized and fixed so during that time you would probably lose some hair and we don't want that.

EC should in theory be enough to halt hair loss due to its apparent high reduction in 5AR enzyme. The problem is that too many people still report hair loss while on it. We need some in-vitro studies. How hard would it be to take 5AR levels before and after taking EC. IH should setup a lab and start testing iodine, thyroid, heavy metals and other stuff because there are virtually no studies about those things and its health effects.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  TrueGround on Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:13 am

>> TrueGround, how much benefit did EC have on your hair, honestly?

The longest I have been on EC was two months straight. I dropped it because I was getting ready for a move for new job so I needed to claw back some funds. Now that I'm settled financially, I've been back on EC ever since.

That said, two months is not long enough to gauge the effect on my hair. The other more short-term physiological effects I noticed indicate EC is great for general health and thus hair growth. I will say, that when I am consistent with a broad spectrum of antioxidants, my hair loss seems to stabilize pretty well.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  TrueGround on Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:25 am

Moby,

We already know that men go on finasteride and can still continue to lose hair. I've heard multiple accounts that while it can drastically slow down progression of hair loss, it still does progress to some degree over time. That being said, I don't see why EC would be any different, only considering its DHT reduction potential. We also know that people can start losing hair like crazy if they go on fin for a while and just drop it for whatever reason they chose to. Again, if ecklonia cava, at some dosage, is as effective at reducing DHT, then dropping it from a regimen at some point would probably lead to further hair loss in the future. Also, I don't think making the statement that any single treatment can halt hair loss indefinitely is true, at least with the treatment options currently available.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  ubraj on Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:32 am

FWIW, many on this forum may not know this but Propecia is only able to stop hair loss for a percentage of people who use is it. The percentage is much higher for those who are young vs older. Some even resort to dut as they are not able to get enough in results from Propecia.

My point being is that it's a myth caused by other hair loss forums that Propecia will stop hair loss. There is a good chance it will but not in everyone. Especially if you're older.






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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  qzack97 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:50 am

Good point. Any regimen you find successful must be kept up for the rest of your life, unless there is nothing you may be doing physically that is causing the hairloss. Having said that, I'd rather it be a herb than a drug, but EC's effectiveness still remains to be seen. It does seem promising however.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  scottyc33 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 3:35 pm

rdkml wrote:FWIW, many on this forum may not know this but Propecia is only able to stop hair loss for a percentage of people who use is it. The percentage is much higher for those who are young vs older. Some even resort to dut as they are not able to get enough in results from Propecia.

My point being is that it's a myth caused by other hair loss forums that Propecia will stop hair loss. There is a good chance it will but not in everyone. Especially if you're older.






My friend has been on Propecia for about 5 years and he has gradually lost hair the whole time.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  theseeker86 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 3:51 pm

It's also possible for it to increase your hair loss when you start taking like what happened to me and many others, i recall on HLT when i use to visit it and post that young people like me would comment on how their hairline has just been destroyed since jumping on propecia and all the comments were either it's all in your head or it's just a shed ride it out.


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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  LawOfThelema on Mon Nov 19, 2012 4:06 pm

moby wrote:>> You could start at (body weight * 0.07 * 100) mg EC
>> The 0.07 factor gives your blood volume; and the 100 comes from your first graph (100 μg/mL EC)

In my case it comes out to - 1568 mg. I would also assume that that's 1568 mg of PURE Ecklonia Cava. No fillers. Fibroboost that's on IHerb is sold at 1200mg per pill but the real amount of EC is much lower.

EC should be enough to stop hair loss assuming you're free of heavy metals

So was that concentration of Diekol itself or the whole EC extract. I think it was of Diekol. That probably change the calculation.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  bobthebuilder on Mon Nov 19, 2012 4:22 pm

rdkml wrote:FWIW, many on this forum may not know this but Propecia is only able to stop hair loss for a percentage of people who use is it. The percentage is much higher for those who are young vs older. Some even resort to dut as they are not able to get enough in results from Propecia.

My point being is that it's a myth caused by other hair loss forums that Propecia will stop hair loss. There is a good chance it will but not in everyone. Especially if you're older.






Agreed, but the ones that dont get the results from Fin is due to the lack of calcification treatment. Minox and Fin working together will target both areas. There is much more calcification in older men.

Hence Heart Disease and Hair loss go together.


Last edited by bobthebuilder on Mon Nov 19, 2012 4:26 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  bobthebuilder on Mon Nov 19, 2012 4:25 pm

qzack97 wrote:Good point. Any regimen you find successful must be kept up for the rest of your life, unless there is nothing you may be doing physically that is causing the hairloss. Having said that, I'd rather it be a herb than a drug, but EC's effectiveness still remains to be seen. It does seem promising however.

Diet alone can stop hair loss, but keeping that diet up in our world is another story.
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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  LawOfThelema on Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:18 pm

scottyc33 wrote:
rdkml wrote:FWIW, many on this forum may not know this but Propecia is only able to stop hair loss for a percentage of people who use is it. The percentage is much higher for those who are young vs older. Some even resort to dut as they are not able to get enough in results from Propecia.

My point being is that it's a myth caused by other hair loss forums that Propecia will stop hair loss. There is a good chance it will but not in everyone. Especially if you're older.






My friend has been on Propecia for about 5 years and he has gradually lost hair the whole time.

ok. Everyones response varies, but for most men the following occurs when they take propecia: their initial response is good, they regrow some hair over the first few years, and then as the years progress their hair counts gradually decline. At the end of 10 years the overwhelming majority still have more hair on fin than when they started.

Diet alone can stop hair loss, but keeping that diet up in our world is another story.

No evidence that diet alone can stop androgenetic hair loss.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  qzack97 on Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:49 am

Diet can certainly help, but I don't think it's a means to an end. If it was, we would all just go on a paleo diet, and call it a day. However with that said, we shouldn't simply go the other extreme and load up on propecia. We should all try and find that healthy middle ground for ourselves.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  qzack97 on Sat Dec 01, 2012 1:01 pm

Hi guys, I started taking Ecklonia Cava this week. Will report back if I see any improvements to my hair. But to be fair, there are other changes I'm making which may have an effect on my hair.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  moby on Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:33 am

Started taking EC almost a week ago. So far the shedding seems to be down and inflammation may be lower. I will continue using it. I still have to figure out the dosing, the 800-1200mg that I'm taking daily is actually worth 13% of that or 104-156mg. Someone mentioned that the optimal dosage is 400mg of actual EC so right now I have no idea on how to reach those levels without spending > $200.

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  Mastery on Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:19 am

bobthebuilder wrote:
qzack97 wrote:Good point. Any regimen you find successful must be kept up for the rest of your life, unless there is nothing you may be doing physically that is causing the hairloss. Having said that, I'd rather it be a herb than a drug, but EC's effectiveness still remains to be seen. It does seem promising however.

Diet alone can stop hair loss, but keeping that diet up in our world is another story.

+ 1

M
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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

Post  mento on Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:44 am

Mastery wrote:
bobthebuilder wrote:
qzack97 wrote:Good point. Any regimen you find successful must be kept up for the rest of your life, unless there is nothing you may be doing physically that is causing the hairloss. Having said that, I'd rather it be a herb than a drug, but EC's effectiveness still remains to be seen. It does seem promising however.
Diet alone can stop hair loss, but keeping that diet up in our world is another story.
+ 1

M
which diet?
does someone still takes EC?

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Re: Ecklonia Cava as effective as Propecia? -- if I'm understanding this paper correctly, why is no one talking about this?

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